New Tow Rating Standards for 2013 it's about time

[perryg114]

There are some new SAE towing standards coming in 2013 so maybe these unrealistic tow rating games will stop.

For some reason, I have problems believing claims that the F150 can tow more than my old 92 F350 could. Toyota has some hard to believe claims as well. It would be nice to see a before and after ratings for this new standard.

Tow Ratings Finally Pass the Sniff Test - The Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) - Automobile Magazine

Perry

[dkottum]

Perry, the new standards include handling and braking requirements. Your old F350 was a workhorse, but could it handle and brake as well as a new F150? More to safe towing than just moving big stuff down the road, isn't there?

doug k

[dkottum]

Where in the towing standards are considerations for a low-profile, independent torsion bar suspension, aerodynamic Airstream compared to a cube-shaped, high profile, solid axle SOB? The power and handling ability needed by the tow vehicle is different.

Driver abilities and experience are different.

I think they would more properly be called "towing guidelines based on standardized testing".

doug k

[DKB_SATX]

Originally Posted by dkottum

Where in the towing standards are considerations for a low-profile, independent torsion bar suspension, aerodynamic Airstream compared to a cube-shaped, high profile, solid axle SOB? The power and handling ability needed by the tow vehicle is different.

Driver abilities and experience are different.

I think they would more properly be called "towing guidelines based on standardized testing".

doug k

That's true, but it's a HUGE step forward from "towing guidelines created in a conference room by legal and marketing teams using a report they don't understand from engineering."

And since we all believe the Airstream to be an easier tow than a white box (all other things being equal) then a vehicle rated to tow an 8000-lb white box should have an easy time towing an 8000-lb Airstream, no?

[dkottum]

Funny DKB' and probably right on the money.

doug k

[purman]

Wow these standards are nothing but a bunch of government workers trying to find something to do to keep themselves a jobs.

I understand there needs to be a general standard. But once again our government have gone beyond that, and are trying to be our mother again.

Read through the link Perry provided. Some of the speed stuff is crazy.

Highway Gradeability
To merit a particular TWR, a vehicle must be capable of maintaining a minimum cruising speed while climbing the grade at Davis Dam on state roads 68 and 163 in Arizona and Nevada. This 12-mile-long run originating in Bullhead City, Arizona, involves grades that vary between 3- and 7-percent with an average over 5-percent. During this test, the minimum acceptable ambient temperature is 100-degrees F. and AC systems must be operating on the maximum cold setting with no recirculation and the blower at the highest possible setting.

REALLY!!!! who comes up with this stuff???

"But after years of effort, the SAE's tow vehicle trailer rating committee is finally ending the farce." REALLY, REALLY.!!!!!!!!

you have got to be kidding me....



anyone not using a 1 ton is pretty much going to be towing 7000 lbs or less. and any old truck, SUV, car is completely out of towing ability...

I trust that my Sequoia can tow 9100 lbs as advertise safely.. but now has a tow rating of 6300, please thats only 1300 more than my 01' 4 runner. For something with more than three times the power and torque, and size...


Time to get rid of the 80% towing rule and go to the ADD 30% towing rule.. If this is how things are to be...

[purman]

OH, yeah don't believe half of what I say, but believe the other half.... I needed a good rant..

[dznf0g]

Dude....the SAE has nothing to do with the government. It is the Society of Automotive Engineers....a professionl organization tasked with commonization of thousands of specs and components, like plug in connectors for electric cars, fuel filler neck dimensions, etc.......

[purman]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

Dude....the SAE has nothing to do with the government. It is the Society of Automotive Engineers....a professionl organization tasked with commonization of thousands of specs and components, like plug in connectors for electric cars, fuel filler neck dimensions, etc.......

And where does the money come from??? grants???

And these specs have what to do with towing??? Engineers who don't live in the real world scare me...

only believe half of what I say!!!

[dznf0g]

Nope, Maunfacturers and members of the professional organization. Many, many automotive engineers are dues paying professional members.

[purman]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

Nope, Maunfacturers and members of the professional organization. Many, many automotive engineers are dues paying professional members.

So are you saying it's Union dues?? I won't even comment if it is

[dznf0g]

NO! It's a professional organization. It's got nothing to do with salaries, or working conditions or benefits, etc. They are an organization which set polices for their industry through cross manufacturer cooperation, etc. They do interact with some government organizations like NHTSA to garner proper standards and specs, for example. Most recently they have started interacting with the consumer electronics industry to promote seamless interaction between consumer electronics and vehicles.

We have started to see compatibility issues with some brands of smart phone and their apps and newest smartest cars with which they interact.

The SAE represents the entire auto industry (in North America) in that problem resolution and standardization process. That's only one example.

[dznf0g]

here:
SAE International

They can explain it much better than I. I see they have a global presence now and do more than automotive. Didn't know that.

[Garfield]

Originally Posted by dkottum

Where in the towing standards are considerations for a low-profile, independent torsion bar suspension, aerodynamic Airstream compared to a cube-shaped, high profile, solid axle SOB? The power and handling ability needed by the tow vehicle is different.
doug k

So true, Doug. IMO commonly held "towing rules of thumb", "urban legend", or "SAE approved", just don't apply 1:1 to Airstreams. As usual, the devil is in the details. I'm towing well over 100% of my GCVWR () yet I'm very pleased with my rig's performance. Couldn't be happier in fact.

[Bill M.]

Read through it. Like it. Be interesting to see if most manufacturers buy into it. Can not do the test in the winter, I guess?. They must be testing now. Has anybody seen them? I guess it is hard to build a 12 mile long test hill so they picked one. Must be some reason for that choice. Doubt if aerodynamics will make a huge difference in these tests because of the low speeds. Not sure why they specified the lowest ratio avaliable? Seems like there should be allowance for different towing capacity for different axle ratios?

[purman]

Originally Posted by dznf0g

here:
SAE International

They can explain it much better than I. I see they have a global presence now and do more than automotive. Didn't know that.

Thanks for the link it explains a lot.


Biggest problem is if not everyone buys into it. If I was any of the auto guys I would have wanted a say in it to buy into it. It doesn't mean anything if they all don't use it. It will be like it is now. Everyone with there own rules for tow capacities.

[Denis4x4]

There are countless examples of the auto industry buying into SAE standards for everything from oil viscosity to setting the shear specs for fasteners. SAE is the gold standard when it comes to setting specifications. I'd buy a TV based on SAE standards instead of those promoted by an ad agency or PR firm.

[SpikeC]

Specs HAVE to be based on worst case scenarios. Anyway, it is a Communist plot to fluoridate our Airstreams!

[dznf0g]

I know GM was an active participant in the development process. Pretty sure Ford and Toyota were too. I just haven't heard much about Ram in this process. Don't know where they stand.

Understand this isn't an "outside entity" like NHTSA or the EPA, etc. SAE members ARE part of the automakers engineering staffs. Of course there are SAE employees, but it is made up of the body of the engineers who are members. More experienced "senior" engineers serve on development committees.

[perryg114]

At least everyone is held to the same standards now. 1/2 ton trucks with over 10,000 tow ratings seems a little ridiculous. My old F350 would haul anything in the bed but it could not stop worth a darn.

My Excursion has a 4:30 Dana 80 rear end with a V10 and the same running gear and frame as the F250/350 but it is rated to tow less than an F150. Splain that to me Lucy.

Perry