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Old 01-14-2012, 07:04 PM   #1
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My 1/2 Ton Numbers

I have a Ford F-150 and a Chevy 1500. Last week, I took the Chevy to the Canopener and ran it thru the scales to make sure I was legal with the numbers. I had both truck and trailer loaded to the gills to see what I could get away with. In the truck was two adults, a 175lb ARE Topper, Two 22 lb propane tanks, two propane heaters, two coolers with drinks in one and bloody Mary Mix and Vodka in the other (plus 40 lbs of ice in each), 1 case of water, two bikes, heavy tool box, heavy junk box, chairs, two tables, and other small stuff. I had more stuff on this trip than I had when I went on a three week trip last summer. The trip back home was a lot lighter. Coolers empty and nothing left of the Bloody Marys. Also 3/4 tank of gas (26 gal capacity)
Here is what I have.
Chevy 1500 5.3L 4X4 Crew Cab 3.42 rear end 17" tires
Max tow package 9,500 lb tow capacity
GCWR 15,000 lbs
GVWR 7,000 lbs
Total cargo 1556 LBS
Axle Front max 3950
Axle Rear Max 3950
Trailer is a 1990 Excella 29 FT GVWR trailer is 6800 lbs
Tongue weight according to bathroom scales 1100 LBS
Hensley Hitch
2 Full 40 lb propane tanks
4 gals water in black tank
1/4 tank grey tank
1/2 tank fresh water

First picture is empty truck with one person plus topper. 5,760 lbs

The next picture is the weights with the WD bars loose, then WD bars tightened.
Once the WD bars were adjusted the axle weight is just about perfect. I am about 60 lbs over the GVWR for the truck. It would be very easy to ditch something I was taking to get that corrected. The trailers 6700 lbs is 100 lbs under the max, but a different truck would not make that any better. I could pull another 1240 lbs of trailer and still be legal topping out my GCWR at 15,000 lbs but still be 600 LBS under my trailer max of 9,500 LBS.
My F-150 6.2L 4X4 Crew Cab 3.73 RE would look even better with a GVWR of 7,700 LBS, GCWR 17,000 LBS, Max Trailer 11,300 LBS and a Max cargo of 1771.
Lot of data there, if I missed something let me know.
Regards,
Joe
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Old 01-14-2012, 08:20 PM   #2
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I am far from an expert on the subject of scale weights but it appears to me that when you add the trailer axle weight (6700#) to the tongue weight (1060#) that your trailer gross weight is approximately 7760#. Isn't the trailer rated for a gross weight of 6800#?
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Old 01-14-2012, 09:10 PM   #3
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So now I just need to find a way to get rid of 800 lbs somewhere in the trailer? That is strange. The ratings for the front and rear axle on the trailer is 3400 lbs each for 6800 lbs total, same as the GVWR.
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Old 01-15-2012, 05:51 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AirHeadsRus View Post
So now I just need to find a way to get rid of 800 lbs somewhere in the trailer? That is strange. The ratings for the front and rear axle on the trailer is 3400 lbs each for 6800 lbs total, same as the GVWR.
Let me say again that I am not an expert on this. I thought someone who knows about trailer ratings and CAT scales would jump in here and shed some light on this subject. I am in a learning mode about trailer loading and weights.
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Old 01-15-2012, 06:33 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ridgerunner3 View Post
Let me say again that I am not an expert on this. I thought someone who knows about trailer ratings and CAT scales would jump in here and shed some light on this subject. I am in a learning mode about trailer loading and weights.
Not to worry, the experts will show up. They are just sleeping in this am.
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Old 01-16-2012, 06:33 AM   #6
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TRUCK

STEER: 3,360
DRIVE: 2,400
empty truck with one person plus topper. 5,760 lbs

GCWR 15,000 lbs
GVWR 7,000 lbs
Total cargo 1556 LBS
Axle Front max 3950
Axle Rear Max 3950

TRAILER

Trailer is a 1990 Excella 29 FT GVWR trailer is 6800 lbs
Tongue weight according to bathroom scales 1100 LBS


Weighing #1 -- TT attached and Weight Distribution Activated

Let Front Axle Load be "FA1" 3,300

Let Rear Axle Load be "RA1" 3,760

Let TT Axles Load be "TT1" 6,700

Then, while in same position on scales, take
Weighing #2 -- TT attached and Weight Distribution Not Activated

Let Front Axle Load be "FA2" 3,100

Let Rear Axle Load be "RA2" 4,040

Let TT Axles Load be "TT2" 6,600

Then, drive off scales and drop TT. Return to scales and take
Weighing #3 -- TV only -- TT Not Attached

Let Front Axle Load be "FA3" 3,360

Let Rear Axle Load be "RA3" 2,400

From the above values, you can calculate:

TV weight = FA3 + RA3 5,760

Gross Combined Weight = (FA1 + RA1 + TT1) 13,740
- should also be equal to (FA2 + RA2 + TT2) if scale weights are correct 13,740

TT Weight = Gross Combined Weight - TV Weight 13,740 - 5,760 = 7,980

Tongue Weight = (FA2 + RA2) - (FA3 + RA3) 1,380 [17%]

Load Transferred to TT Axles
when WD System in Activated = TT1 - TT2 100



Okay, it's o-dark-thirty here, but will give this a shot:

It's a part of the puzzle to have the Solo, Empty, but one needs the TV as a solo value when loaded for travel; to have parked and dropped the trailer for a trip across the scale separately for the TV.

But, as one can see, we can't quite get the picture of the TV when Solo, Loaded, thus the WDH adjustments (if needed) are also not quite clear. We're missing a scale reading, IOW. (Second is the weight of the TT, Solo, Loaded if the 6,800-lb figure is the published, not actual, weight. (15% of 6,800 = 1,020; an 1100-lb TW suggests higher than 7,300-lbs on the TT).

So, it looks as though there is still some adustment range left. 25% of TW is 275-lbs which we might see on the TT axles after WDH applied. There would also appear to be some room onto the FA as well. Guidelines of how GM sez to set up their vehicle should be consulted. (75/25 distribution? 60/40?). Even when we use the older "1/3" distribution rule, 1,100-lbs ought to see 360-lbs per axle distribution of TW.

Some will argue that perfection isn't necessary, but it's more important, IMO, to have the numbers as close as possible to see how the rig feels when moving down the highway. It's a test more than a goal. The potential range of WDH adjustments for a given combination isn't all that wide, we're just trying to narrow down that range to the reasonable.


A comment by Robert Cross applies: (Once the numbers have been worked) "I have tried adding that 100lbs to the TV steering, no difference, trailer is level when using original setting. And it really doesn't make a difference in drivability."


If the handling of the TV is closest to the Solo "feeling", so to speak, then other problems of steering slop, tire pressures, tire design, alignment (both vehicles) and brake drag are more evident; that being a little off seems to have a larger effect when hooked together.

We're looking for the weak links in the chain once WDH is close according to numbers. Having made a compromise in one direction or another (which is where numbers take us at the end); the driver acquires the feel of what the rig can do. Changes to that "feel" are then cause for investigation.

And it's not a question of "legality" outside of, perhaps, tire loading. Manufacturer guidelines are just that, guides, they have no force of law.


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Old 01-16-2012, 07:09 AM   #7
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Thumbs up Good job..

Joe,

I think Red will agree....

You've done a good job doing your "CAT" homework.

Your numbers look pretty good, you now have a good baseline to work with and an understanding of what you are trying to accomplish. You should have no problem transferring that understanding when setting up the Ford.

Good Luck...

Bob
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Old 01-16-2012, 09:11 AM   #8
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In the first post you state "legal with the numbers." If you are referring to the possibility of getting a ticket for being overweight then please don't worry about it. DOT cannot give a private vehicle a ticket for being overweight. I deliver campers all over the country for a living and in Arizona I have to carry an overwidth permit because AZ says the awning on the side of the camper makes it so. A privately owned camper does not have to have the permit.

Godspeed,
Trent
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