Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 09-03-2016, 09:13 AM   #15
4 Rivet Member
 
sgschwend's Avatar
 
1986 25' Sovereign
2008 F350, 6.4L diesel , Oak Harbor, WA
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 429
Images: 11
You should also examine the maintenance cost when factoring cost per mile. Before you decide on what power plant to look for.

A towing package which includes rear end ratio needs to be checked. You don't want to over-stress your system due to smaller components.

Tow vehicle weight matters, 1:1 is the common rule of thumb. Looks to me that you are in the 1 ton truck range.
__________________

__________________
sgschwend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 09:34 AM   #16
Rivet Master
 
dkottum's Avatar
 
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake , Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,716
Quote:
Originally Posted by sgschwend View Post
. . . Tow vehicle weight matters, 1:1 is the common rule of thumb. Looks to me that you are in the 1 ton truck range.
That's not true. Vehicle stability matters, and that is achieved with wide suspension stance (independent suspension), low center of gravity, minimum tire sidewall flex, and for towing a capable weight distribution hitch and proper setup and adjustment (the Hensley/ProPride design offers absolute stability from trailer yaw inputs).

Heavy tow vehicle weight is harder to stop, harder to control when you have to, more likely to roll when you can't, and more likely to injure it's occupants and others if you do.
__________________

__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles

The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
dkottum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 09:40 AM   #17
Rivet Master
 
Currently Looking...
Nowhere , Somewhere
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,266
So much info, none backed up with facts. Remember an undersized, marginal tow vehicle is a death trap. Don't need any facts to prove that, just common sense. Remember, those preaching no pickups are forcing you into a more dangerous tow vehicle for towing..
__________________
avionstream is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 10:13 AM   #18
4 Rivet Member
 
1973Argosy's Avatar

 
1973 Argosy 24
hartselle , Alabama
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 408
Everyone needs to remember that as little as 40 years ago our forefathers were pulling 30 foot streams with their family station wagons or what ever vehicle they had a hitch on, most with out death. We pull with a 2000 expedition, 5.4 and 3.73 gears, and I have yet to feel like I didn't have enough truck to do the job. Modern 1/2 ton suvs and pick ups almost all have 9 to 10,000 lb tow capacities. A 3/4 ton truck or suv will do the job easier but don't count out a properly equipped 1/2 ton. While I haven't towed over the Rockies, the 5.4 has had no issues in the Appalachians with my fully loaded trailer of 6500lbs.
__________________
1973Argosy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 10:21 AM   #19
Rivet Master
 
dkottum's Avatar
 
2012 25' Flying Cloud
Battle Lake , Minnesota
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 7,716
1973Argosy, that makes another point. Not everyone is towing over the Rockies, or wants to. O.P. hasn't indicated their plan.

A fully independent suspension V8 Expedition is an excellent tow vehicle for many Airstreamers.
__________________
Doug and Cheryl
2012 FC RB, Michelin 16, ProPride 1400
2016 Ram 1500 Laramie Crew Cab 4X4 Ecodiesel 3.92 axles

The Truth is More Important Than the Facts
dkottum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 10:43 AM   #20
Well Preserved

 
1993 21' Sovereign
Colfax , North Carolina
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 20,134
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1973Argosy View Post
Everyone needs to remember that as little as 40 years ago our forefathers were pulling 30 foot streams with their family station wagons or what ever vehicle they had a hitch on, most with out death. We pull with a 2000 expedition, 5.4 and 3.73 gears, and I have yet to feel like I didn't have enough truck to do the job. Modern 1/2 ton suvs and pick ups almost all have 9 to 10,000 lb tow capacities. A 3/4 ton truck or suv will do the job easier but don't count out a properly equipped 1/2 ton. While I haven't towed over the Rockies, the 5.4 has had no issues in the Appalachians with my fully loaded trailer of 6500lbs.
40 years ago the 31 foot Airstreams weighed 4400 pounds, and rarely were towed over 50-55mph. Now, a 30 foot Airstream can approach 10,000 pounds when loaded, and if you tow under 60-65, you'll probably be run down from behind.
__________________
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.
Terry
overlander63 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 11:09 AM   #21
3 Rivet Member
 
Thiss's Avatar
 
1971 27' Overlander
Monmouth , Oregon
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 206
Station wagons and fullsized sedans from the 60s and 70s shared the same frames, engines, transmissions, and rear ends as their pickup cousins.

Current half tons are offen up to the task; however, you need to much more dialed in on your pick of vehicle set up. Especially the transmissions, and torque converters particularly, as many are not ready for the extra heat generated to maintain RPM needed to stay in the power curve.

Wieght is both your friend and enemy. It will need more friction to stop, and complicates the center of gravity for stability; however, it is less likely to get shoved around. A nice, light, low, well handling sports car travels a downhill corner like its on rails, but can it do the same with a trailer in tow that weighs twice as much as it?

The advice about mechanical ability is very fitting for this budget category. Buy what you can maintain and repair. My first TV was built by me and was way south of $15k.

Whatever you choose, proper weight distribution and sway contoll hitch are paramount. Also, don't go cheap on your car seats. The Bretix Frontier is great seat and keeps the kids in a 5 point for much longer. They cost an arm and a leg, but in the long run you will buy fewer seats and your kids will be safer.

Speed is a primary culprit of wrecks while towing, but hey if you go with the minivan advice you won't have that problem. If you go the diesel route, just remember to slow down.

The longer your wheel base the better you will tow. Many of the SUVs are quite possibly the worst TV because they have short wheel bases and high center of gravity. Sorry Jeep GC owners, I have a 2004 myself, it has to the worst option possible. As others suggested, an Excursion or a Burb work well because of the longer wheel base. If you choose a pickup and are worried about rollover, the a two wheel drive is an option to have lower center of gravity. Put a limited slip or driver controlled locker to have at least a 2 wheel wonder.

Manufacture's recommendations are sometimes too conservative for GVWR but far too liberal with "towing capacity;" however, you will be better off staying within them.

I don't know it all. I have experience, but not enough since I am young. So take what I say with the all important skill of critical thinking. In fact the best thing I have taken away from these threads this summer is to just slow down. All of the TV we use have the ability to wreck and all of us could then be on the recoeving end of "I told you so." Therefore, I have just slowed down, enjoyed the ride, and have worried less about having my potential wreck analysed on the forum like this summer's thread on the unfortunate Jeep in Quebec.

The Appalacians are hills. If you plan to only fulltime it East of the Rockies, then your choice in vehicles is much larger. If you plan to come this way, you have a lot more considerations. Anyone who disagrees with me is welcome to come visit next summer and I will lead the caravan. I will even pick the easiest routes and drive slow for the underpowered and marginal tow vehicles. We can compare knuckles each night around a fire.

Leaving no dragon to sleep in this post, when moving wieght diesel is better than gas. A gas rig will often do the job, but you are going to visit a lot of fuel stops and you better be ready to change the oil every 5,000 miles like clockwork, and also hope the previous owner did the same. Rods and rings wear out easier on a gas than a diesel; it is a non argument because the fuel itself has less lubricity. Speaking of librocation, check the Trans fluid and the differentials on your potential vehicle. Did the previous owner maintain it for keeps or just to use it up and trade it in?

Sorry for being curt. I should be off the grid camping, but my wife got called to cover a day shift, and she already had to work the holiday. I don't belong on the forum this weekend.
__________________
1971 Overlander Twin bed, rear bath.

2016 Ram 3500 Cummins 4x4 Crew Longbed
Thiss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 12:29 PM   #22
Rivet Master
 
2012 19' International
Southeastern MI , Michigan
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 734
The new Grand Cherokee is far superior to your 2004. "Sorry" lol. Has full independent suspension etc etc. and the Overland is top luxury when not towing as well. Mine is awesome. I'm replacing our second car with an F150 next year so I'll do a comparison then.

On the fire dept I saw a lot more big pickup wrecks than anything else, possibly due to ego but plenty of those drivers were old enough to know better. When it snows those suckers really start piling up in the tow yard.
__________________
2018 International Serenity 27' FB
Goodyear Endurance tires
Hensley Arrow hitch

Tow Vehicle: Ford Superduty crew cab 6.2L V8
Countryboy59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 12:58 PM   #23
Rivet Master
 
Al and Missy's Avatar

 
2002 30' Classic S/O
Melbourne Beach , Florida
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,237
The following is just my opinion based on towing a 6300# Safari 25 for two years and around 9000 miles with a 2006 F150. After it refused to climb an 8% grade in the Appalachians I traded up to a 3/4T turbo-diesel truck.

Something no one has mentioned that I saw in reading this thread is payload. An older (2006 and earlier) half ton pickup can be rated to tow 8000# but will likely be deficient in the payload department. My 2006 F150 with the 5.4 V8, 4-speed transmission, and a 3.73 rear end was rated to tow 8600#, but the payload (passengers and cargo) was only 1240#. Subtract off the tongue weight of my Safari 25 (760#) and I only had 480# left for me, DW, dogs and anything else I needed to carry. The payload (described as capacity for passengers and cargo) can be found on the sticker in the driver's door frame. Each vehicle is different due to options and accessories. If anything (a bed cap, for example) has been added since assembly at the factory the weight of that has to be subtracted from the label value.

So you want to tow a 8000# trailer. Recommended tongue weight for stability is 10-15% of trailer loaded weight. Lets use 12.5% -- 1000#. Subtract that from the payload capacity of your prospective vehicle. In my case that only leaves 240#, an obvious fail. So assuming two adults at 150# each, two children in car seats - another 40# each, and some luggage and camping gear - another 200#, that comes out to close to 1600# of capacity needed.

So, for me anyway, a minimum tow vehicle would have more than 1600# of payload and somewhere around 8500# of towing capacity to give some margin over the 7000# that you would actually be towing remembering that the truck is carrying, not towing, the 1000# of tongue weight.

Al
__________________

"You cannot reason someone out of a position they have not been reasoned into"

Al, K5TAN and Missy, N4RGO
2002 Classic 30 Slideout
S/OS #004
2013 Dodge 2500 Laramie 4x4 Megacab Cummins
2001 Safari 25 RB Twin (Gone, but not forgotten)
WBCCI 1322, TAC FL-39, AIR 82265

Al and Missy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 01:07 PM   #24
3 Rivet Member
 
Thiss's Avatar
 
1971 27' Overlander
Monmouth , Oregon
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 206
Just because it has Inferior Full Suspension? J/k we look forward to getting a new Overlander in a couple of years; a EcoDiesel option being our first choice. Nevertheless, it won't be towing our '71 Overlander.

Everything can wreck in snow. I prefer my old truck in the snow, but we take the Jeep to the ski resorts just because it is easier to park; both have snow tires. Growing up in Eastern Oregon, I saw a lot of the same trucks driving in the snow year after year and staying out of wrecks. I remember a few getting wrecked too though, usually because of a black cow on the highway or the driver drinking though. I am surprised they pile them up so readily in snowy and flat Michigan. Perhaps speed is the top contributing factor? It is a good thing there aren't any mountain passes and grades to deal with because you would be even busier.

Thanks Al for bringing one more important conciderarion to the table!
__________________
1971 Overlander Twin bed, rear bath.

2016 Ram 3500 Cummins 4x4 Crew Longbed
Thiss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 03:19 PM   #25
1 Rivet Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 17
I bought my 2002 Chevy Silverado Duramax for $10k with 150k miles 1.5 years ago. Through previous experience I wasn't a fan of Chevy (replaced 2 engines). However, I absolutely love my Duramax. I only recently purchased our first ever travel trailer so I cannot speak from experience, but just feeling the power between my gas trucks vs my Duramax you can tell it just wants to pull something with all that power.

Anyways,if you want a diesel truck, there out there, just takes some looking. I was looking at Ram trucks as I have 2 girls both in car seats too, but decided against it due to rear an size. My brother in law has a 2010 Ram, love it, but my 3yr old has no room whatsoever for her legs in her car seat behind any if the front row seats, she hates it. YMMV with that.

Good luck on your purchase!
__________________
shaneskee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 03:48 PM   #26
Overland Adventurer
 
AtomicNo13's Avatar
 
1991 34' Excella
2009 34' Panamerica
Telluride , Colorado
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,859
You can buy a decent Excursion with the v10 for 5-7 k. Then have enough to fix modernize and have a budget for fuel for a year. The v10 is everything a diesel is but chesper to maintain.
well maintained a v10 excursion can easily see 350000 miles.
We have towed our 34' Airstream heavy for nearly 200000 happy cheap miles.
If they were still produced I would buy another!
__________________
AtomicNo13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 05:45 PM   #27
Free Range Human
 
Drathaar's Avatar
 
2012 25' FB Flying Cloud
Currently Looking...
Twin Rocks , Oregon
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 708
Images: 4
With your budget, I'd look for a 1999-2003 Ford F-250/350 crew cab with the 7.3 liter powerstroke, and moderate (150,000ish) miles. I'd also look for one with a complete maintenance record. I sold mine earlier this year, and still miss it.
__________________
Drathaar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2016, 09:02 PM   #28
Rivet Master
 
TG Twinkie's Avatar
 
1974 Argosy 26
Morrill , Nebraska
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,120
Images: 2
Blog Entries: 5
Looking for a TV under $15k that hauls 8k+

If you are not in need of 4WD you should be able to find a good 1/2 ton truck. I bought an '08 Tundra 5.7 Ltr V8 with tow package for $18K four years ago. It has been a great truck. Have towed close to 25K miles with no problems. Been in every state west of the Nebraska border and over most if not all of the mountain passes traversing the continental divide.
__________________

__________________
Knowledge: "A gift to be shared. A treasure to receive."
TG Twinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
15K BTU Brisk Air vs. 15K BTU Penguin adwriter73 Furnaces, Heaters, Fireplaces & Air Conditioning 9 05-23-2011 10:32 AM
Got my Carrier 15K BTU installed chuman70 Furnaces, Heaters, Fireplaces & Air Conditioning 2 06-22-2007 06:07 AM
15K BTU Dometic A/C tripping breaker silverback Furnaces, Heaters, Fireplaces & Air Conditioning 48 07-11-2006 09:14 AM
Who Got What - Holiday Hauls? Janet H Off Topic Forum 35 01-07-2005 12:02 PM
15k BTU A/C unit info Silvertwinkie Furnaces, Heaters, Fireplaces & Air Conditioning 0 09-21-2003 02:17 PM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:30 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.