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Old 12-04-2012, 04:46 PM   #57
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and you've done that on a bicycle towing an airstream and then later a sob to measure the difference???
LoL!
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Old 12-04-2012, 05:12 PM   #58
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A tow vehicle doesn't give a tinker's damn about wind resistance when it's towing 8000 pounds up a 8% grade at 10,000 ft AMSL at 30 MPH, all it see is the grade and the additional 8000 pounds.

That's what manufacturer's tow ratings are about, not about going thru a slalom course.
You're right, the slower the speed the less important the drag and the more significant the weight. But how often are you towing up grades like that and going at 30mph?

Try clocking your gas mileage on the level for a few hours into a headwind and compare it to your usual consumption, then you'll see the effect of wind resistance.

Most tow ratings are not worth the paper they're written on; they're not much more than marketing tools and bear little or no relation to the actual towing capability. As I said before, you can't quantify towing into a simple measure of weight, there are just too many variables.
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Old 12-04-2012, 05:27 PM   #59
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Something I haven't seen brought up here is the stability controls that have been added on the new models. They will make the combination handle much safer than the. Tv's of yesteryear
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Old 12-04-2012, 05:29 PM   #60
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Aero resistance means more than weight. The "tow ratings" all have frontal area restrictions which limit weights. Were they an honest assessment they would also include length and sidewall height. They don't . . and thus aero trailers slip through the cracks of what is possible according to general common sense. Ignorance of what is possible. Nothing new here, it's been understood with some thoroughness since the 1930's . . just forgotten or ignored. Drowned under TV ads and the like.

And, if the majority of cars, etc, are never tested -- just given a generic "rating" -- that then serves the profit dished up by pickups to the OEM's.

An Airstream and it's cousins is a TT designed to be towed by automobiles. Putting a poor performing truck-based TV in front of one is rather bass-ackward, in main.
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Old 12-04-2012, 05:40 PM   #61
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You're right, the slower the speed the less important the drag and the more significant the weight. But how often are you towing up grades like that and going at 30mph?
Frequently, but then I don't live and mostly tow in Ontario, Canada where a hill of 1000 or so feet is called a "peak".
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:04 PM   #62
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Something I haven't seen brought up here is the stability controls that have been added on the new models. They will make the combination handle much safer than the Tv's of yesteryear
Where the German SUV's are tops.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:06 PM   #63
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A tow vehicle doesn't give a tinker's damn about wind resistance when it's towing 8000 pounds up a 8% grade at 10,000 ft AMSL at 30 MPH, all it see is the grade and the additional 8000 pounds.

That's what manufacturer's tow ratings are about, not about going thru a slalom course.
You've never used a car to pull one of these, have you?

.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:13 PM   #64
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On the subject of wind resistance, our Honda Pilot had two ratings: one for boats and a lower one for trailers. Seems to me that was because of the boat's aerodynamics.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:26 PM   #65
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You've never used a car to pull one of these, have you?
No, but I've used a couple of SUV's. Have you?

Call it what you will, and I'm sure you will, but I believe the vehicle manufacturer's engineers know more about their products capabilities than any RV retailer.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:31 PM   #66
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I have a 1994 Jeep Cherokee Sport that I tows my 26' Argosy. I use load leveling bars to help with the tongue weight. I wouldn't take it in the mountains or snow but have towed successfully throughout Florida.
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Old 12-04-2012, 07:35 PM   #67
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Hey Brian, Go for the Grand Cherokee, but wait for the Diesel. Oops. You are in the US. Get the Hemi.
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Old 12-04-2012, 08:10 PM   #68
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I know a guy that owns both a late model 30-footer, as well as a 60's caravel. One weighs 3-4x the other. He tows with the same tug---gets exactly the same mileage with each trailer. Although the weights are very different, he front profile of both trailers is nearly the same.
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Old 12-04-2012, 09:21 PM   #69
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I think you can tow an Airstream up a hill with a car or I have had some very vivid dreams.

Independence Pass 12100' 1987 Olds 88 3.8 Litre V/6 front wheel drive.

The Lexus 3.0 Litre RX300 on the Alaska Highway it also went to Panama and many other trips.

Taurus SHO and a Mercedes R Class on Appalacian Pass in Vermont 18% grade.

One reason for the wear in the Excursion tranny is that it is working all the time even without the trailer it takes a lot to push and Excursion around and the V10 is pretty much the max power for this transmission. Synthetic oil helps a great deal in transmissions and rear axles if you are not already using it.

When you tow with an effiecient vehicle it is taking very little power to move it the 80% of the time it is solo so there tends to be less wear. It is amazing how little trouble our customers have with their front drive v6 tow vehicles. The customers with pickups and conventional SUV's have far more driveline problems. Part of that could be attitude when driving maybe people towing with a car are more in touch with their machinery, they don't go "its a truck it can handle it".

I cannot think of any customer ever turned down for a warranty repair because they were towing with a car mini van etc. Worst case scenario and you were turned down you are still many thousands of dollars ahead of the game.

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Old 12-04-2012, 09:33 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew T View Post
I think you can tow an Airstream up a hill with a car or I have had some very vivid dreams.

Independence Pass 12100' 1987 Olds 88 3.8 Litre V/6 front wheel drive.

The Lexus 3.0 Litre RX300 on the Alaska Highway it also went to Panama and many other trips.

Taurus SHO and a Mercedes R Class on Appalacian Pass in Vermont 18% grade.

One reason for the wear in the Excursion tranny is that it is working all the time even without the trailer it takes a lot to push and Excursion around and the V10 is pretty much the max power for this transmission. Synthetic oil helps a great deal in transmissions and rear axles if you are not already using it.

When you tow with an effiecient vehicle it is taking very little power to move it the 80% of the time it is solo so there tends to be less wear. It is amazing how little trouble our customers have with their front drive v6 tow vehicles. The customers with pickups and conventional SUV's have far more driveline problems. Part of that could be attitude when driving maybe people towing with a car are more in touch with their machinery, they don't go "its a truck it can handle it".

I cannot think of any customer ever turned down for a warranty repair because they were towing with a car mini van etc. Worst case scenario and you were turned down you are still many thousands of dollars ahead of the game.

Andrew T
Andy:
That is exactly what my transmission guy said about the ex. Your comment is spot on!
I also have an R class, never crossed my mind to tow with it. Any pics of that set up? Was it the 500 or the 350?
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