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Old 01-02-2015, 05:12 PM   #71
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This has been a very interesting discussion!! One thing that I would like to bring to the table is the subject of LIABILITY. If you knowingly overload, or exceed the gross combined vehicle weight, of the tow vehicle and trailer, you are opening yourself up to a liability issue if you are in an accident. We all know how insurance companies like to refuse claims, and how vehicle manufacturers like to refuse warranty claims. I would hate to be in a situation where I was being sued for an accident, that was caused by an improperly loaded vehicle. Just "because you can", will not cut it in a court of law. Just my thoughts.
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Old 01-02-2015, 05:13 PM   #72
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only when you have driven a bmw x5d do you understand the sophistication of the vehicle.
the torque, the all wheel drive, the huge brakes and the engineering make it a pleasure to drive safely. clearly there are folks on this forum who would like to compare it as a tow vehicle to a heavy 2 wheel drive pickup with a fixed rear end.

there is much more to this equation than some of the "experts" on this forum profess to know.

nevertheless i love the entertainment and the absolute conviction by those who may not know as much as they think they know.
I think you are missing the point here. No one here is saying BMW X5 is not the ultimate driving machine. We are saying its not the ultimate towing machine -- Its only rated to tow 6000#. A less refined pickup can tow 10,000#. A much less refined heavy duty pickup can tow a lot more.
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Old 01-02-2015, 05:22 PM   #73
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I have no beef with trucks being used as tow vehicles - that's a personal choice.

What I do take issue with is posts that perpetuate myths that have been proven wrong time after time again - the "the brakes will fail" myth is just one of many, closely followed by the "insurance won't pay out" myth, closely followed by the "it's illegal" myth.

Most of these are posted without specifics, but embellished with dire and increasingly colourful warnings of the potential consequences - I've seen posts that threaten everything from vehicle impounding to now killing orphans. When asked, none of the posters is ever able to back these up with facts that go further than "car manufacturers know best" or "I don't need math to know what I know".

If I am a person new to towing, who comes here looking for help, I'd be scared out of my wits, and quite unnecessarily so.
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Old 01-02-2015, 05:25 PM   #74
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No, this observation is not truck specific. All cars/trucks I have seen, whether American/Japanese/European have this issue, where the published payload is the Maximum payload, not applicable for majority of vehicles. Actual payload is the driver side door sticker, and user manuals refer to that figure, not the published figure -- which is usually hundreds of pounds more. GVWR minus the door sticker gives you the actual curb weight.
Well, I guess you haven't seen many BMWs then. Or Touaregs. I only have one of those at home today. The published payload for my vehicle on the BMW site is the same as all the third party web sites. It is the same as the owner's manual I have in my hand. I walked downstairs and read the door sticker again. And surprise, it is the same info on the door sticker. To the kg and lb. Same story with axle ratings, GVWR, and curb weight, all the figures match.

Now, with that out of the way, we still have the situation whereby the published payload does not equal the difference between the published GVWR and the published curb weight. Even after accounting for fuel and driver. There are two figures, the inferred (calculated) payload, and the published one. And they differ by 360 lbs for the X5d. Can't seem to blame it on the door sticker.
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Old 01-02-2015, 05:31 PM   #75
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Same here. Door sticker, manual and website all agree.
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Old 01-02-2015, 05:40 PM   #76
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Well, I guess you haven't seen many BMWs then. Or Touaregs. I only have one of those at home today. The published payload for my vehicle on the BMW site is the same as all the third party web sites. It is the same as the owner's manual I have in my hand. I walked downstairs and read the door sticker again. And surprise, it is the same info on the door sticker. To the kg and lb. Same story with axle ratings, GVWR, and curb weight, all the figures match.

Now, with that out of the way, we still have the situation whereby the published payload does not equal the difference between the published GVWR and the published curb weight. Even after accounting for fuel and driver. There are two figures, the inferred (calculated) payload, and the published one. And they differ by 360 lbs for the X5d. Can't seem to blame it on the door sticker.
I actually looked at a Touareg 2 years ago, and it had the exact same issue. Door sticker payload was lower than the published figure in VW website. My recommendation to anyone buying a vehicle is to see the door sticker of a similarly equipped vehicle before buying and not rely on the published figure as your situation seems to be the exception rather than the norm.
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Old 01-03-2015, 08:43 AM   #77
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Oh boy!...here we go.


I vote not to close this thread. Just clean house.

Bob
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Old 01-03-2015, 08:53 AM   #78
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Oh boy!...here we go.


I vote not to close this thread. Just clean house.

Bob
Yep, going the way of all tow vehicle threads. People ask for opinions of tow vehicles, then people give their opinion, and other people don't like those opinions because they differ from their own opinion, and arguments start, then escalate.

I think everyone should learn the hard way which vehicle will work for them, and which will not, just like I did.
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Old 01-03-2015, 09:17 AM   #79
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Entertaining nevertheless. I do not know why anyone asks for tow vehicle advice. It seems impossible to trust the answers because, repeatedly, they are all over the map. The only real conclusion is that you need to try your existing tow vehicle under a variety of conditions and see how it goes. If you are in the market for a new tow vehicle do not come to this forum for advice. Too bad, because before I bought my AS I used the forum advice for my hitch and bought a ProPride. I have not regretted that decision and I am sure it is why I am completely happy with my Silverado 1/2 ton.
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Old 01-03-2015, 09:17 AM   #80
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Yep, going the way of all tow vehicle threads. People ask for opinions of tow vehicles, then people give their opinion, and other people don't like those opinions because they differ from their own opinion, and arguments start, then escalate.

I think everyone should learn the hard way which vehicle will work for them, and which will not, just like I did.

For the record - I have no problem with varied opinions - it's what makes the forums so valuable. My specific problem is the trolling behavior that violates the rules we all agreed to in order to participate here - it's what makes the forums unnecessarily and frustratingly tedious.

Your strategy for selecting a hitch sounds like a good one :-)

I really appreciated the value of the discussion here in making my selection (as a complete rookie). There was always some heat along with the light but overall, the approach was fairly civil. That's when the forums work best in my opinion. At the end of the day, there are many "right" answers...

Now about that OP.....

Stay salubrious everyone!
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Old 01-03-2015, 10:26 AM   #81
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Back to the original question.

I would suggest trying it out with the Eaz-Lift system you have. I think you will find that on the X5 the 25' will be more stable than the 19. With the 25 the higher hitch weight means that the torsion bars will need to do more work to transfer weight so the hitch geometry comes more into play which adds to stability. The wider stance and tandem axle contribute as well.

If you did want to go one step further with the Eaz-Lift we can make up a welded ball mount and ship it to you. A welded ball mount further reduces the rear overhang and is much nicer to handle when unhooking. Here is a picture of a welded ball mount set up on a Cayenne which is similar.

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Old 01-03-2015, 10:34 AM   #82
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Hi, I didn't pick my hitch; I was told by the selling dealer what they were giving me for free with my new trailer and it has been great for over ten years.

My problem with hitch discussions is some of the PPP type hitch people seem to be preaching. They remind me of the people who tell you that if you don't go to their church and believe what they believe, you're going to 7734.

I'm not an insecure person and I'm very happy with my tow vehicle, my trailer, my hitch, my Marathon tires, and my drum brakes. If you're not, then buy what makes you happy, be happy, and stop preaching!
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Old 01-03-2015, 10:37 AM   #83
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Hi, I didn't pick my hitch; I was told by the selling dealer what they were giving me for free with my new trailer and it has been great for over ten years.

My problem with hitch discussions is some of the PPP type hitch people seem to be preaching. They remind me of the people who tell you that if you don't go to their church and believe what they believe, you're going to 7734.

I'm not an insecure person and I'm very happy with my tow vehicle, my trailer, my hitch, my Marathon tires, and my drum brakes. If you're not, then buy what makes you happy, be happy, and stop preaching!
Very well said
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Old 01-03-2015, 10:51 AM   #84
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Thanks Andrew T, good to see the master at work. Shortened ball mount, hitch head and w.d. bars tilted down, spare (re)moved to accommodate tongue weight for a particular vehicle and customer's needs.

While we're all using the bigger hammer approach.
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