Equalizer 10,000 or 12,000

[SCOTTinNJ]

I had a 25' with 600# bars towing with a 1/2 ton f150. Never felt like the bars were heavy enough as I experienced sway when trucks passed.

I bought a used 30' 1200 miles from home and towed it empty with the 600# bars. Clearly they were not enough. Sway was worse.

I bought 1000# bars and that was much better.

I've now purchased a 2017 F250 4x4 XLT. I have 450# in the bed plus a truck cap that's probably 250#. My trailer is also loaded for full time travel so is probably on the heavy side. Will weigh it soon.

Anyway the 1000# bars seem perfect. No sway at all in about 1000 miles of travel. I would not go any lighter.

Towing with the 1000# bars and f250 has been so much more relaxing than the f150 with any bar/trailer combo I've used.

[Mollysdad]

Originally Posted by tyggeln

On the topic, I measured my tongue weight as 1080# on my 28' CCD, and therefore have the 1200# bars which gives a bit of margin, but not much (90% of rated). Would prefer the 1400# bars with that high a tongue weight (77% of rated) to avoid stressing the welds.

Perhaps I'm not thinking this correctly, but wouldn't 1400# bars stress the welds MORE? No flex, all leverage.

I have 1000# bars and they seem (to a novice) to be darn stiff. I'd hate to have one fall on my toe. If Equal-i-zer specifies 1000# bars for 1000# tongue weight and 10,000# trailer weight, why fight them?

[uncle_bob]

Hi

The actual amount of force you get out of any bar when setup for the same WD is identical. It's just transferring force from the tongue to the receiver. Same force gives you the same WD.

When you go over a dip or a bump, a stiffer bar will indeed give a bit more force (in one direction) or a bit less force (in the other direction).

The gotcha is that at a reasonable angle (number of washers) you may not be able to get enough force with light bars to accomplish the desired WD.

Bob

[franklyfrank]

Originally Posted by Mollysdad

Perhaps I'm not thinking this correctly, but wouldn't 1400# bars stress the welds MORE? No flex, all leverage.

I have 1000# bars and they seem (to a novice) to be darn stiff. I'd hate to have one fall on my toe. If Equal-i-zer specifies 1000# bars for 1000# tongue weight and 10,000# trailer weight, why fight them?

I could be wrong but I don't believe that any of those short stiff trunion bars have any flex.

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by franklyfrank

I could be wrong but I don't believe that any of those short stiff trunion bars have any flex.

Hi

As you go over a hump or a dip in the road (think of exiting a gas station) the bars either flex or break. The same flexing occurs when you raise of lower the trailer with the jack.....Yes, looking at them it's a bit hard to believe. The "1,000 pounds" ratings come from some specific amount of deflection. Is that 6" at the tip or something else? ..... who knows.

Bob

[Bob662]

Here's the essence of what I learned from CanAm Andy: the longer the TV wheelbase, the harder the bars have to work to transfer weight to the front axle. Given your quite long wheelbase, I'd think the 1200 lb. rated bars would be needed. The counterpoint is--you've selected a very stiff WD system, since the Equalizer bars do not taper from the hitch socket to the friction plate. Thus, the stiffer the hitch the more likely to experience a rougher trailer ride and perhaps sheared rivets.

I'm using a Curt WD hitch with an F-150 to pull a 25 ft. FC trailer. AndyT recommended, and I use, 1400 lbs. bars for this combination (although Andy prefers the Eaz-lift hitch). These Curt bars are barely enough to move appropriate weight to the front axle.

If you select 1000 lb. bars, be prepared to change to 1200 lb. bars if you can't transfer enough weight to the front axle to restore at least half of the "nose up" movement with the trailer attached but no bars connected.

[dkottum]

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

As you go over a hump or a dip in the road (think of exiting a gas station) the bars either flex or break. The same flexing occurs when you raise of lower the trailer with the jack.....Yes, looking at them it's a bit hard to believe. The "1,000 pounds" ratings come from some specific amount of deflection. Is that 6" at the tip or something else? ..... who knows.

Bob

Another 40 year Airstream repair shop owner and forum member "Inland Andy" from Inland RV in Corona, CA knows. Because he tested them and published the results.

http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hit...bar-story.html

Use the Equal-I-Zer hitch at your Airstream's own risk. Most of the flex you get will not be in the w.d. bars but your truck and trailer suspension, frames, and hitch receiver. If your tow vehicle is stiffly suspended much of the flex is in the remaining components (my Airstream's cabinets are coming apart and loose stuff is all over the floor).

[Mollysdad]

Originally Posted by dkottum

If your tow vehicle is stiffly suspended much of the flex is in the remaining components (my Airstream's cabinets are coming apart and loose stuff is all over the floor).

...and yet the same folks (not you personally) talk about how great it is to go boon docking down some potholed road, where the trailer frame drags and they need 4WD.
I think this forum is a great place for overstating one's case.

Meanwhile, Equal-i-zer is the most recommended hitch by Airstream dealers, so I'll listen to the hitch makers and what they recommend. Until I have first hand experience.
"Equalizer recommends 1000# bars, but Joe at the welding shop said to use 1200# bars, and Fred at "Hitches-R-Us" said I'll blow out my front tires, so to be safe, I'm going to use 1400# bars!"

[slowmover]

The two Airstream shops -- Inland and Can Am -- together have nearly 100-years experience. Neither recommend it. As it offers no advantage over others of its type, it's disadvantages stick out.

Good luck

[Mollysdad]

Originally Posted by slowmover

The two Airstream shops -- Inland and Can Am -- together have nearly 100-years experience. Neither recommend it. As it offers no advantage over others of its type, it's disadvantages stick out.

Good luck

Two? Well, that settles it. Both named Andy. A coincidence? I think not. What about the hundred that did recommend it?
However, I did agree with pretty much everything "Andy" said in this:
http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hit...bar-story.html

[GM Airstream]

Originally Posted by Mollysdad

Two? Well, that settles it. Both named Andy. A coincidence? I think not. What about the hundred that did recommend it?
However, I did agree with pretty much everything "Andy" said in this:
http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hit...bar-story.html

Well I hate to argue.. so we will keep it simple... we be engineer.. and indeed we have towed our trailers a lot of miles... First started out with station wagons... and then move up to PU truck when they started the california cad program... i.e making them more lux'ry... We have always and always will use the reese hitch... they are the leaders in the industry... so we and others have found... EZy lift of course is the OTHER company that also was around then and now.. but its the little set up .. .bolt up... attachement things that make the real difference... and while reese went through a re-design of the equal/sway control...(which we found to be 2nd class and opened up the door for EZy lift to move into the market) We still like the basic concept of the reese engineering.. (and no we are not drilling holes in our trailer frame to put the cams on) So we use the first gen reese hitch with U bolts on the cam sway contorl action...

That being said.. those that don't think the 1000# bars will flex.. need to go back and see some of the slow motion photo that was done when they were proving themselves... indeed a lower number bar such as the 550 or 750 lb bars are thin'er... but then again the wheel barrow lifting action at the back of the tow vehicle will be less... so it depends on what your 'SAG' down at the ball is happening... determines the wet of the bars used... NOTHING ELSE...

The ideal wt is to spread the total RV + TV across the 4 axles... i.e 33% front TV ... 33% Rear TV... and 33% Trailer axles... ya it doesn't add to 100% but close enough that you get the idea of how the system is supposed to work... and now you know why you need to weigh the TV and Trailer.. They want you to load up the rear of the TV.. i.e PU with what you are going to carry... or worst case condition wt. That then will determine what wt bars you really need... Remember the equal bars are their to bring the rear of the TV up and transfer some of the weight to the front axle... kinda like a Teeder totter... across the rear TV axle...

The other factor in the bars being loaded are that on reese the sway control is accomplished by cam action.. placing more weight on one side or other as the trailer turns slightly... You normally will pull up on the bars which then react with the cams and arms... (one thing to note here.. a lot of sway control was accomplished by a friction bar attached to one side of the trailer A frame... they work... sometimes.. but get 'em wet and you might as well not put it on... as well as they don't seem to work so well because they are so short coupled... i.e from the ball hitch to about 20 inches back on one side of the trailer A frame. We found that they are worthless. in slight sway conditions.. and really don't work when they get wet from rain or spray coming up under the TV between it and the trailer front)

As to the bars carrying ability... you will see in the old Reese selection guides that the bars.. i.e 1000# ones.. actually will work from about 600 lbs to the full 1000# lifting action on the rear of the vehicle... by Overhitching... you can delete the springing action you need and soften the ride for the trailer... Of course tire air pressure also can play into the vert impact loading that the trailer frame experances...

In adds of old.. they (reese) used to use a big car that was front wheel drive... I think they were called tornados... and would take the rear tires off the vheicle... to show the weight cary'n ability... it was a bad stunt... as today that is not what we want... we want equal wt on the TV axles and trailers....

So why does the dealer suggest 1000# over 500# bars... easy.. he doesn't know what your going to load up the rear of the vehicle with... but, you can soften the ride if the weight is not their by leaving the bars ...hanging with lower pressure on them... (however you need some for the cam action to work.. and you want the TV and Trailer to both ride level... (most important) and the weight distru'bted... across the TV's axles/tires.. and the trailers...

Today we use PU trucks for TV's... and they (PU) are set up to carry a load in the bed of the truck... by themselves... thus to keep the TV level you don't need much up lifing by the equalizer bars... just enough to keep everything level..... so pulling up on 1000# bars fully is not what you want... unless you need it to ride level...

To set up reese.. you find a parking lot.. level the trailer and measure the ball height... then on the TV you set the top of the ball about 1 in higher to take care of the slight sag'n... from their you adjust the equ'zr bars to bring the trailer and TV back to level... check out the install directions from reese and or EZlift.. both are set up just about the same... once set with the PU and trailer hitched up... you adjust the uplift of the equalizer bars to get the hitch back up to the level line height of the trailers org'nal level measurement...

Now if you change the weight in the back of the TV... you only adjust the uplift on the equ'zr bars... either up or down within the bars range... to achive level... you never change the ball height on the TV...

... most of the time the rear of the TV's weight is going to change as you add or remove thing... so after you do the level measurement setting (remember the number you had when the trailer was level ...front to back... write the hitch height down.. and keep it... its what I call the level line measurement...)

One simple test you should do... after getting things level.. is to go jump up and down on the hitch ball area.. (rear truck bumper) with the trailer hooked up... if you can spring it up and down...and its level. .you have arrived at the best you will get ... again.. the PU is sprung much more heavy than what we used to pull trailers with.. such as station wagons... that needed the lift of the rear to make it ride level...

So which bars to get... the ones that will give you the level ride with min uplifting of the equz'lr bars... (again see the old charts for reese.. they have ranges for their bars... ) You don't need 1400# bars for a 800 # tong weight... that is what is called over hitching ....and will do damage to the trailer because it wont give you the soft ride you need... both in the TV and trailer...

Hope my writing has helped you decide what to get...

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by dkottum

Another 40 year Airstream repair shop owner and forum member "Inland Andy" from Inland RV in Corona, CA knows. Because he tested them and published the results.

http://www.inlandrv.com/articles/hit...bar-story.html

Use the Equal-I-Zer hitch at your Airstream's own risk. Most of the flex you get will not be in the w.d. bars but your truck and trailer suspension, frames, and hitch receiver. If your tow vehicle is stiffly suspended much of the flex is in the remaining components (my Airstream's cabinets are coming apart and loose stuff is all over the floor).

Hi

If all the bars are totally rigid / inflexible, then there is absolutely no reason to use one bar over the other. It is true that there is flex in other parts of the system. That's not the entire story. I'm not arguing that it's a perfect system, just that indeed there is flex in the bars. I "test" that every time I put the trailer onto the hitch ....

Bob

[jcanavera]

Interesting that Reese's latest and greatest hitch, the Steady-Flex seems to be a modernized version of the Equal-i-zer. Very similar concepts of the solid bar. Here's a link to a video comparing it with the Equal-i-zer. https://www.etrailer.com/comparison....&pc2=EQ37101ET

Jack

[franklyfrank]

Originally Posted by uncle_bob

Hi

As you go over a hump or a dip in the road (think of exiting a gas station) the bars either flex or break. The same flexing occurs when you raise of lower the trailer with the jack.....Yes, looking at them it's a bit hard to believe. The "1,000 pounds" ratings come from some specific amount of deflection. Is that 6" at the tip or something else? ..... who knows.

Bob

I have personal experience I based my comment on.
Our first AS 30' International came with a dealer installed Trunion bar hitch. On our first trip going out west on I-76 this was before they began rehabbing it, our shower door fell down, there were countless popped rivets mainly on the ceiling and it two days for my body to settle down. Admittedly it was the worst road I traveled on before or since. When I took the AS in for warranty work on the Shower door and popped rivets I was advised to consider a non trunion bar hitch. A year later I traveled the same road with a spanking new Blue Ox hitch and a new set of Michelin tires ( had to get rid of the GYMs due to a massive blow out), the ride was normal in all aspects. I still had to slow down to 40 MPH to get through some of the really bad sections but nothing was disturbed in the trailer.

[Cmadonna99]

The RV Service Center I have used for various reasons in the renovation of my 1972 Airstream Safari recommended the following:

Fastway e2 System. I was informed Fastway and Equalizer are the same.

Your thoughts and comments will be appreciated.

[SCOTTinNJ]

Originally Posted by SCOTTinNJ

I had a 25' with 600# bars towing with a 1/2 ton f150. Never felt like the bars were heavy enough as I experienced sway when trucks passed.

I bought a used 30' 1200 miles from home and towed it empty with the 600# bars. Clearly they were not enough. Sway was worse.

I bought 1000# bars and that was much better.

I've now purchased a 2017 F250 4x4 XLT. I have 450# in the bed plus a truck cap that's probably 250#. My trailer is also loaded for full time travel so is probably on the heavy side. Will weigh it soon.

Anyway the 1000# bars seem perfect. No sway at all in about 1000 miles of travel. I would not go any lighter.

Towing with the 1000# bars and f250 has been so much more relaxing than the f150 with any bar/trailer combo I've used.

Towed 500 miles today. No sway. No popped rivits.

All good.

[pteck]

Originally Posted by franklyfrank

I have personal experience I based my comment on.
Our first AS 30' International came with a dealer installed Trunion bar hitch. On our first trip going out west on I-76 this was before they began rehabbing it, our shower door fell down, there were countless popped rivets mainly on the ceiling and it two days for my body to settle down. Admittedly it was the worst road I traveled on before or since. When I took the AS in for warranty work on the Shower door and popped rivets I was advised to consider a non trunion bar hitch. A year later I traveled the same road with a spanking new Blue Ox hitch and a new set of Michelin tires ( had to get rid of the GYMs due to a massive blow out), the ride was normal in all aspects. I still had to slow down to 40 MPH to get through some of the really bad sections but nothing was disturbed in the trailer.

While this is interesting, I don't believe this can be squarely put on the hitch. There are numerous other factors including WD pre-load, tire pressure of your trailer, type of vehicle you towed with, manufactured stress points in a new trailer, etc. I do believe you had an issue, but the whole setup has to be looked at critically.

For every story like yours, there's likely many many more success stories with the Equalizer, including mine. What differentiates successful from problematic comes down to the specific application, use, and calibration of the setup.

[Mollysdad]

Originally Posted by Cmadonna99

The RV Service Center I have used for various reasons in the renovation of my 1972 Airstream Safari recommended the following:

Fastway e2 System. I was informed Fastway and Equalizer are the same.

Your thoughts and comments will be appreciated.

I don't know if they're the same, but they're the same company. I always thought Fastway was the "value" brand Equal-I-zer.

I see they sell the "round bar" as well as the "Trunion" hitches.
The round bar looks like the offspring of a Blue Ox and an Equal-i-zer.
I'd be curious if they all USA made.

[mstephens]

My Equalizer Hitch Experience

Suburban 1500 with 25FC and 1000# bars.

We did lots of towing over mountains, tight turns etc. I broke a hitch head, and I broke a riser stem. We had pieces of the bathroom wall come loose and fly around the bathroom. Some rivets popped. Some other small damage.

At the time, I felt I was doing the right thing by leveling the 'Burb and meticulously achieving the weight transfer, even though it was REALLY hard to get the back of the burb high enough to set the bars into the brackets. It seemed wrong, but I continued to do it. That was 4 years ago. We sold our A/S and TV for other reasons.

Fast forward to today. With much thinking about the old rig, I feel that there was ZERO give in the hitch. It was 100% stiff. Someone in this thread mentioned "bouncing on the hitch" to see if there was some spring. Mine had NONE. It made wild popping sounds when we hit driveway ramps. And, we suffered two wildly dangerous broken hitches (Got to the bottom of the Panamint pass in Death Valley and the hitch was barely attached by less than an inch of weld).

I'm only posting this as a data point. An experience. I have no horse in the race right now, except I am in the market for another A/S and another Suburban and another "hitch." I don't want anyone to think I am trying to argue any point, other than cite my experience.

My thought experiment while reading this post was this: Suppose I just take my suburban and put 750# in the back. It has a payload of about 1400 or so. Would I lose my steering? Would I be wickedly unsafe because the axles now had different weights? Aren't we supposed to be able to put some weight in the back? There are three rows of seats. Can we put people in them? I'm not being facetious. My intuition is that I WAY OVERHITCHED and created a nearly stiff connection with no give at all.

I don't know what kind of hitch I will use when I get a new rig. I will be following these discussions though. I am consideirng a Suburban K2500 which has a 2600# payload. Do I really need WD? Or just sway control? Those are rhetorical questions. Just thinking out loud.

[uncle_bob]

Originally Posted by mstephens

My Equalizer Hitch Experience

Suburban 1500 with 25FC and 1000# bars.

We did lots of towing over mountains, tight turns etc. I broke a hitch head, and I broke a riser stem. We had pieces of the bathroom wall come loose and fly around the bathroom. Some rivets popped. Some other small damage.

At the time, I felt I was doing the right thing by leveling the 'Burb and meticulously achieving the weight transfer, even though it was REALLY hard to get the back of the burb high enough to set the bars into the brackets. It seemed wrong, but I continued to do it. That was 4 years ago. We sold our A/S and TV for other reasons.

Fast forward to today. With much thinking about the old rig, I feel that there was ZERO give in the hitch. It was 100% stiff. Someone in this thread mentioned "bouncing on the hitch" to see if there was some spring. Mine had NONE. It made wild popping sounds when we hit driveway ramps. And, we suffered two wildly dangerous broken hitches (Got to the bottom of the Panamint pass in Death Valley and the hitch was barely attached by less than an inch of weld).

I'm only posting this as a data point. An experience. I have no horse in the race right now, except I am in the market for another A/S and another Suburban and another "hitch." I don't want anyone to think I am trying to argue any point, other than cite my experience.

My thought experiment while reading this post was this: Suppose I just take my suburban and put 750# in the back. It has a payload of about 1400 or so. Would I lose my steering? Would I be wickedly unsafe because the axles now had different weights? Aren't we supposed to be able to put some weight in the back? There are three rows of seats. Can we put people in them? I'm not being facetious. My intuition is that I WAY OVERHITCHED and created a nearly stiff connection with no give at all.

I don't know what kind of hitch I will use when I get a new rig. I will be following these discussions though. I am consideirng a Suburban K2500 which has a 2600# payload. Do I really need WD? Or just sway control? Those are rhetorical questions. Just thinking out loud.

Hi

Indeed you can "over do" a WD setup. It's also true that dropping an engine block in the back of a pickup, then driving down the road is not all that crazy.

Most vehicles have different ratings with and without WD. My F-250 is weird, it's rated the same either way. If you don't have WD *and* are still inside the ratings of the vehicle (axles, receiver, tow ...) then in a sense you are "safe". How safe is a completely different question.

Anti-sway is indeed different than WD, but they are very much related to each other. Pull a couple hundred pounds off the front wheels and you change the steering a bit. That truck you see going down the road 12" lower at the back probably isn't much fun to drive.

One other "interesting" thing you bring up - lifting the back of the TV to get the bars on. How much does the back of the truck weigh? If you have a camper on it, there's a *lot* of weight back there. What is the hitch / shank / receiver / jack rated for in that mode? Lots of questions and very easy answers. Yes, you could use the pry bar gizmo .... how many do? Hands please ? ... hmmm.... that's what I though.

Bob