Classic-30 tow vehicle F150 vs F250?

[2012FB]

Originally Posted by FCStreamer

The question was "can I tow a 30' Classic with a 150?" The answer is yes. And safely. You will have to,watch your weights and configure your F150 correctly, but it can be done, and is done by many on this forum.

This statement from above which is shared by many is the crux and at the same time the obvious answer to the original question. I'll review what I have read with regard to towing with a 30" with a F150 though I am sure I will miss some points.

Configure the F150 with max tow package and other HD options as available.
Configure the F150 with higher gearing.
Upgrade the tires.
Carefully weigh the truck and trailer separately on CAT scales fully loaded with all occupants, full tank, dogs, gear, spares etc. to insure you are not over the maximum specifications.
Choose the proper WD hitch assembly, have it professionally installed. Then take it to the CAT scales and weigh it carefully with and without the trailer to insure proper balance.
Stay under 60 mph.
Don't put the motorcycle or golf cart in the back .
Been doing it for years with no problems.

As stated above the F150 will be at the maximum rated limits towing the 30' and stock F250/2500 will be well under the maximum.

Your choice Maxed out or well inside the Safety Zone.

[joshjack]

Originally Posted by VernDiesel

Answer; The truck with the best WDH & weight distribution. (proven on a scale).

Um: no. WDH are nice and make towing more comfortable, but no substitute for towing capacity.

When you have to stop suddenly, or you run across some rough railroad tracks or a poorly maintained bridge expansion joint you'll still have over 8000 lbs jerking you around.

[FCStreamer]

Originally Posted by Spectre

Safety isn't binary. There is always risk and we can never be 100% safe. The trick is manage the risk with appropriate tools and procedures. You seem to be doing a good job of this for your circumstances.

I agree with you. But you are either "in the zone" or you are out. The numbers are the numbers. You can choose to heed them or ignore them. But even if all the numbers match there is always "risk". We do what we can to manage it.

[txhornet]

Been lurking at the Airstreams for some time now, Yesterday drove a 2017 Ford 250 Diesel Superduty love it. Leaning on the classic new or used, before I spend the money on the truck is the 250 more then enough truck, are should I aslo take a look at the 350?

[joshjack]

Originally Posted by txhornet

Been lurking at the Airstreams for some time now, Yesterday drove a 2017 Ford 250 Diesel Superduty love it. Leaning on the classic new or used, before I spend the money on the truck is the 250 more then enough truck, are should I aslo take a look at the 350?

A 250 will be enough truck, but a 350 would be even better. However, a 350 may ride a little rougher when empty.

Always buy as much truck as you can - and not much difference in price and ride between 250/350.

[2012FB]

When I was looking the salesman stated that the only difference between the 2500 and the 3500 was one extra spring on the rear axle stack and a slightly higher rear axle rating. Everything else is the same. F250 or 2500 is more than enough especially going Diesel, unless maybe you want to put a Gullwing, golf cart, or camper on the back of the truck.

[Ambot]

The 2017 F350 has a different, larger rear end unless you configure a F250 with the high capacity trailer tow package.

[ijustlee]

If some is good, more is better! That's the American way! Get the F250 and look in the mirror every now and then to make sure the trailer is still there. My 3/4 ton fits in the same parking space as a long wheelbase 1/2 ton. Think about how many miles you will tow over the life of the truck and think about if the Diesel option is worth it.

[Moflash]

Originally Posted by 2012FB

When I was looking the salesman stated that the only difference between the 2500 and the 3500 was one extra spring on the rear axle stack and a slightly higher rear axle rating. Everything else is the same. F250 or 2500 is more than enough especially going Diesel, unless maybe you want to put a Gullwing, golf cart, or camper on the back of the truck.

This is a common miss conception as both the F350 and the F250 ride on the same primary leaf spring so they ride exactly the same.The difference is in the amount of payload capacity reserve ( which quickly disappears when going on a Airstream adventure).Why would you limit yourself when the cost is $650 on a tow vehicle that lists for $60k-$72k?


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[VernDiesel]

There is good thought, discussion, and humor in this thread. Can't say I didn't and other readers won't enjoy and learn from reading it. It IS a never ending discussion. Newbs ask what seems to be a simple logical question. And it starts over no matter where it ended the last time a newb asked the question.

Veterans from both sides if you will answer and may be correct but don't answer well enough to be correct to include all the other variables that the other veteran is building into his model or thought process. The only thing not done this time is the guy saying well then why not get a semi to tow a Bambi.

This I understood before posting earlier.

I guess my motivation comes from trying to for lack of a better description inspire people to actually weigh their axles & employ weight distribution and the value of it. Instead of either just spending & buying a bigger truck or more importantly telling others they must buy a bigger truck in order to buy X trailer without first sharing about the overall importance of weight distribution in the consideration of whether their existing truck is big enough for X trailer. They may be happy with the new trailer and the way it tows with their existing truck once set up properly.

And even if you buy a new big truck you should still weigh and set up your truck & trailer as often more of safety stability & enjoyable drama free towing is in the setup than in being under a payload number.

[mefly2]

Originally Posted by SusanFleck

Agree with all the comments about half and three quarter ton trucks. We really wanted the 1500 but our dealer set us up with a 30 footer loaded to same weight as a Classic (bags of cement!) and had us tow with the 1500 and 2500. No question the 2500 was much better choice. This summer we went over the Bighorn Mountains in Wyoming and knew the 1500 would never make it. It's a lot of truck when not pulling a trailer but we are happy with the choice we made. Good luck to you!

Well said !
Our dealer let us tow before we bought ... no decision after the "tow ride" ...

[Bev1940]

Remember when the Suburban was the tv of choice for AS? I towed my 31' AS every where for years with my 1500 GMC even to Yukon when my truck was 13 years old never had a bit of problem, finally had to replace truck with a new 2014 1/2 ton GMC 1500 and i get 151/2 mpg with it. I see tvs out there that can tow a house and they are hooked to a 25 or 27 ft AS. The dealers want to sell big trucks for big bucks cuz that's their job!

[DC Bruce]

The limiting factor is not the "towing capacity" of the truck. Many higher-end 1/2 tons are rated to tow more than 10,000 lbs., including F150s with the Ecoboost engine and Chevy/GMCs with the 6.2 engine and max trailer tow package. You can go to pickup trucks dot com and see that, as a group 1/2 ton trucks stop in a shorter distance than 3/4 tons. While the brakes may be bigger, the empty 3/4 ton truck itself weighs from 1,000 to 1,500 lbs. more than the empty 1/2 ton, the most extreme comparison being between the aluminum F150 and the Ram 2500 with the very heavy Cummins Diesel engine. Gasoline engines provide engine braking because they work against a closed throttle. Diesels do not; so they have to have trick turbos to generate back pressure. Larger displacement gas engines produce more braking than small ones which, perhaps is why people moving from the 3.5 liter Ecoboost engine to a diesel perceive such a big difference. People moving from the GM 6.2 liter gas engine might not see as big of a difference. That's probably the one drawback to using a heavily turbocharged small displace gas engine in a tow vehicle.
The real issue is cargo capacity of the tow vehicle. In a year of shopping (and reading tests online), I have never seen a 1/2 ton with more than 2,000 lbs. of cargo capacity the way most people buy them (crew cab). Typically, cargo capacity is around 1700 lbs., even with "max" packages. If you figure a realistic weight of 1,000 lbs. that the trailer puts on the truck (and W/D hitches out most of the redistributed weight on the front axle of the TV, so the TV is still carrying the weight) and you figure two people are going to weigh 300-350 lbs, that leaves about 350 lbs of "stuff" in the bed of the truck. A bed cap weighs about 100 lbs., so there's 250 lbs of available cargo. If you have a couple of kids, or a kid and a dog, you're down to 100 lbs or less of available cargo, with the typical 1700 lb. cargo capacity of the F150 crew cab. By contrast, I think the smallest 3/4 ton cargo capacity 3/4 is the Ram 2500 with the very heavy Cummins diesel is over 2200 lbs. and the Ford and Chevy/GMC diesels are greater still. The gas engine powered 3/4 tons have even more cargo capacity but on a power to weight ratio towing your trailer, they're going to be greatly inferior to the 3.5 Ecoboost Ford and 6.2 GM V8 engines in a half ton because the same or less horsepower is going to be lugging 1,000 lbs or more added vehicle weight not to mention more cargo.
In terms of fuel costs, owners of the 3/4 ton diesels report about the same mileage I get with my GMC 6.2 which has gasoline direct injection and cylinder deactivation. Diesel fuel seems to be generally cheaper than the premium gas my engine requires.
The other issue is range. The 3/4 tons all seem to have bigger fuel tanks than the half tons (although you can get an optional big tank on the F150, but at the expense of cargo capacity).
Summarizing, IMHOP, the reasons to go with the 3/4 ton diesel are greater range and greater cargo capacity. The newest gas-powered 1/2 tons are fully capable of pulling and stopping any Airstream trailer, when equipped with the right "packages." My wife and I have completed 35,000+ miles of full-timing around the American west, including 2 cross- country trips in the past year, including plenty of miles on "RVs and trailers not recommended" roads using our 2015 GMC 1/2 ton with the 420 hp 6.2 engine, 8-speed tranny and max trailer tow package and were completely satisfied.
We are thinking about a possible trip to Alaska via the Allan highway. I'm not sure this would be the right truck for this because of limited range (26 gallon tank) and the need for additional cargo capacity to carry the recommended additional spare wheels/tires for both the truck and the trailer.
Having test driven the lot of them, I think it's undeniable that 1/2 tons ride better and are more car-like than 3/4 tons. Also, with a $7,000 sticker price add-on for the Diesel engine, it's hard to imagine, everything else being equal (trim level, other options) the out-the-door price of a diesel 3/4 ton would be the same as a 1/2 ton. More likely, in my shopping experience, the dealer doesn't have a half ton on the lot that meets your specs (I had to fly to Denver to get my truck) but has a 3/4 ton in stock. Dealers like to sell from their inventory rather than order a custom specified unit.

[Al and Missy]

A couple more considerations -

While the diesels have to rely on an exhaust brake, when so equipped the engine braking is greater than that of a gasoline engine due to the much higher compression ratio.

My Ram/Cummins torque peak is at around 1700 rpm. My F-150 was at about 3200 rpm. In order to climb an 8% grade towing my Safari (6300#) I was in 2nd gear (older 4-speed transmission) at about 25-30 mph and turning 3500 rpm. Lots of heat output and not much air flow over the radiator and transmission cooler. The turbocharged gasoline engines like Eco-Boost have much flatter torque curves, but the naturally aspirated ones do not. A newer truck with a tow/haul mode and a 6-, or more, speed transmission can get a better match than I had, but my Ram goes up that hill towing my 9100# Classic at 50 mph, right on 1700 rpm.

Altitude causes a loss in power for naturally aspirated engines. The effect on turbocharged engines is greatly diminished.

The previous comments on payload are correct. My F-150 had only 1240# of payload and the trailer tongue weight ate 760# of that leaving only 480# for driver, passengers and cargo. It was rated to tow 8600#, which should have been fine for the Safari.

I towed my 6300# Safari 25 with the 2006 F-150 5.4 V-8 with the 3.73 rear end and with the Ram 2500, and towed the 9100# Classic 30 Slideout with the Ram. I love the fact that I don't have to worry about what is around the next curve towing with the Ram. It truly is worry-free towing.

Al