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03-25-2016, 12:08 PM
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#21
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Rivet Master
1977 Argosy Minuet 6.0 Metre
Colorado Springs
, Colorado
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 739
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Sure you can trust them, trust them to be heavy. :-) But then that is part of the reason they tow so well.
__________________
Royce (K0RKK) 146.460 simplex
Web page https://spearfishcreek.net/
AIR# 3913
'77' Minuet 6 Metre, behind a 2005 stock Jeep Rubicon with Equa-L-Zer hitch.
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03-25-2016, 12:14 PM
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#22
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Rivet Master
2014 31' Classic
2015 23' International
2013 25' FB International
Apache Junction
, Arizona
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 6,215
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At the dealership, our new 2013 25FB International Serenity with full water and propane tanks, dealer installed street and rear awnings, dealer installed 155 watt solar system and the Hensley Arrow hitch installed had a Sherline scale tongue weight of 1,150 pounds. Loaded for camping and moving our stuff around for best weight distribution, the best we could do was 1,175 pounds by the Sherline scales.
Those numbers were very close to the CAT scale numbers as well.
The 773 pound Airstream literature tongue weight morphed to 1,350 pounds with four Lifeline 92 pound batteries (configured as 600 amp-hours) on the tongue. When those were removed along with the custom stainless steel enclosure and a 600 amp-hour lithium was mounted inside the Classic, the tongue weight dropped to 1,175 pounds.
__________________
WBCCI Life Member 5123, AIR 70341, 4CU, WD9EMC
TV - 2012 Dodge 2500 4x4 Cummins HO, automatic, Centramatics, Kelderman level ride airbag suspension, bed shell
2014 31' Classic w/ twin beds, 50 amp service, 1000 watt solar system, Centramatics, Tuson TPMS, 12" disc brakes, 16" tires & wheels
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03-25-2016, 01:09 PM
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#23
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Rivet Master
, Minnesota
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schu
All trailers are weighed once they come off the line and those weights are printed out on the stickers that are attached. They will vary based on options and model decor but are weighed on computer scales.
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They just checkweigh the traiers to make sure there's nothing in there that wasn't paid for.
Like an extra vent fan or mechanic's tools.
Or a QC inspector that fell asleep in the closet.
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03-25-2016, 01:57 PM
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#24
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:SPACE A" S/O 11 Air19745
2006 34' Classic S/O
Fort Worth
, Texas
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,766
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dkottum is right in Post #9. But, it really is a science if you compare it to aircraft weight and balance. It all boils down to the [weight (mass) X arm (length) = moment (torque)] being ahead of the center of gravity (CG) far enough to make the aircraft (trailer) stable so it can handle the operator induced or environmental upsets and return or remain dynamically stable, i.e., not sway (yaw, pitch, or roll about it's longitudinal axis. A horizontal line through the CG going from rear to front. If it goes divergent, think jack knife or roll over. Just ask my FedEx pilot son what would happen to a Boing 777 freighter if the loading crew forget to lock down the shipping containers. There is a fine line of balance between not enough, just right, and too much tongue weight. Just right and the trailer "feels" perfect at all speeds. The same with aircraft, but computers now allow aircraft to fly way out of normal hand flying range. The same hold true for computer sway controls and trapezoid designed hitches on travel trailers. They make handling instability easier and/or possible.
guskmg
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03-25-2016, 02:26 PM
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#25
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Rivet Master
2012 27' Flying Cloud
W
, New England
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schu
All trailers are weighed once they come off the line and those weights are printed out on the stickers that are attached. They will vary based on options and model decor but are weighed on computer scales.
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As in Schu's news? 😀. Good to see you here!
Can you describe how they're weighed for what I believe you call "hitch weight"? In other words, I'm assuming a level trailer but "hitch" could mean you measure at the ball or at the jack foot or somewhere else? Thank you!
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03-26-2016, 09:15 AM
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#26
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1 Rivet Member
2015 25' Flying Cloud
Fairhope
, Alabama
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 8
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Tongue Weight Discussion
I have been concerned about tongue weight on my 25 ft, RB, for some time. I performed the measurement using the bathroom scales and some lumber, and calculated 1050 lbs. I discussed this with the dealer and he was not concerned. I believe the only detrimental effect is extra wear on the TV rear tires, even though I run about 5 psi extra pressure. I also added a bike rack (with bikes) to the rear of the AS. When we are under way, I do not store anything heavy in the front of the AS. From all of this discussion, it would appear that Airstream should direct a little more attention to the issue and provide some parameters. At some point, one has overloaded the AS bow, the hitch, and/or the TV stern.
Before my Airstream I owned a 17 ft. Casita. I added a storage box to the rear (against manufacturers' recommendations), then had to carry several cinder blocks in the front when under way to counterbalance the load and prevent fishtailing. Well, this finally caught up with me and I had one of the tires blowout while traveling down the interstate. In hindsight, I had simply overloaded the tires. Thank goodness this did not happen in the middle of Yellowstone Park, which is where we had been. The moral to this story is to know your weights, measure them at a CAT scales, calculate those you cannot measure directly, and have everything within appropriate limits. I do this, and am comfortable with all the weights, even the slightly heavy tongue weight FOR MY SITUATION. We use our rig a lot (did a round trip to Nova Scotia - 6000 miles recently and before that Utah parks and Grand Canyon, etc.) and I watch tire wear carefully plus other maintenance. Get educated on your own particular situation, if not already, and enjoy your trips.
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03-26-2016, 09:25 AM
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#27
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Rivet Master
2014 31' Classic
2015 23' International
2013 25' FB International
Apache Junction
, Arizona
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 6,215
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Note that the weight data tag created by Airstream only lists the total empty weight at the time it rolled off the assembly line and was towed the 150 feet to the right bay of the shed to the scales. The tractor drops the connection and pulls away, the trailer is weighed and then it is towed out to storage. Then they take that scale generated number and subtract it from the published GVW for that unit to generate the allowable payload number.
At no time do they "verify" by scale the literature tongue weight versus the actual tongue weight and supply that information to the consumer.
That is a key piece of information to serve as the starting point for tow vehicle selection based upon the tow vehicle listed payload. Once loaded for camping with all the stuff aboard and full tanks, a trip across the CAT scales will confirm whether the actual tongue weight is within bounds for the tow vehicle.
__________________
WBCCI Life Member 5123, AIR 70341, 4CU, WD9EMC
TV - 2012 Dodge 2500 4x4 Cummins HO, automatic, Centramatics, Kelderman level ride airbag suspension, bed shell
2014 31' Classic w/ twin beds, 50 amp service, 1000 watt solar system, Centramatics, Tuson TPMS, 12" disc brakes, 16" tires & wheels
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03-26-2016, 09:43 AM
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#28
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"Cloudsplitter"
2003 25' Classic
Houstatlantavegas
, Malebolgia
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 20,000
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Ok....
.......I'll throw my monkey wench into the fray now.
2003 25' foot Classic.
GVWR 7300lbs. CCC a meager 676lbs
On a trailer equipped with two 3500lb axles.
...and you wonder why I....
....for storage.
__________________
I’m done with ‘adulting’…Let’s go find Bigfoot.
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03-26-2016, 09:58 AM
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#29
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3 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
jackson center
, Ohio
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 159
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Hitch weights
2015 Flying Cloud weights
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03-26-2016, 10:44 AM
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#30
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3 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
jackson center
, Ohio
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 159
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Weights FC
Weight sheet
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03-26-2016, 10:54 AM
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#31
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Rivet Master
2012 27' Flying Cloud
W
, New England
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 7,402
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schu
Weight sheet
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Thanks - my 2012 27FB Flying Cloud also had 791# as the "hitch weight" number. On the scales, fully loaded for camping including full FW tank, propane tanks and other "stuff", my "tongue weight" has been calculated to about 1060# (or about 270# above the factory calculation for "hitch weight"). I do use a ProPride hitch which probably puts about 150# on the a-frame and as a FB queen model, my storage is just behind the propane tanks and batteries. So it is somewhat nose-heavy from the trailer's perspective.
Still curious what Airstream means by the term "hitch weight" in this context and where/how exactly it is measured. Thanks!!
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03-26-2016, 12:50 PM
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#32
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Living Riveted since 2013
2016 Interstate Lounge Ext
Green Cove Springs
, Florida
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 8,201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schu
Weight sheet
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The cake is a lie. Just sayin'
__________________
Rocinante Piccolo is our new-to-us 2016 Interstate Lounge 3500 EXT
(Named for John Steinbeck's camper from "Travels With Charley")
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03-26-2016, 01:11 PM
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#33
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Rivet Master
2006 25' Safari
St. Augustine
, Florida
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,670
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It may be correct! Mine is rated at 860# and it is actually 990# on a CAT scale. Sometimes companies though can be tough regarding sales. You might try recording the transaction repeating the policy in the future.
P.S. Be careful posting about companies. I have a story regarding a recorded purchase. Five times in the recording I say that I want a rectangular mattress cover saying it over and over for my radial mattress Airstream!?! Even the sales person mentioned the previous radial twin mattress I ordered and I say no . I posted on the forum and they came after me. I plan on making my own recordings when ordering things like that in the future.
__________________
WBCCI 8653/AIR 60240
2022 Ford F150 PowerBoost Platinum w/7.2KW
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03-28-2016, 01:45 PM
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#34
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3 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
jackson center
, Ohio
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveSueMac
As in Schu's news? 😀. Good to see you here!
Can you describe how they're weighed for what I believe you call "hitch weight"? In other words, I'm assuming a level trailer but "hitch" could mean you measure at the ball or at the jack foot or somewhere else? Thank you!
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The trailer is taken to the weigh station,which is on a level pad. There are sensors for double and single axle trailers as well as for the Jack post.The trailer is then leveled and weighed. Actual weight and Cargo carrying capacity is recorded on trailer labels/tags.
The tongue weight is taken on every unit along with actual weight.I don't believe their is a requirement to list each units tongue weight.
The tongue weight listed in the brochures is with gas bottles and propane and no other options. The listed weight is the average taken of that model units. I believe the spec sheets at dealers have the weight of each option package.
My two cents.
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03-28-2016, 03:00 PM
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#35
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1 Rivet Member
Currently Looking...
Evanston
, Wyoming
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 14
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what has been a realistic TW on a 22' sport?
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04-06-2016, 10:23 AM
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#36
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Rivet Master
2008 30' Classic S/O
Dearborn
, Michigan
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,403
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Be sure the trailer is *perfectly* level.
Inches high(lower weight) or low(higher weight) will affect your reading.
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