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mefly2 · 04-29-2014, 08:29 AM

TerryG - Thank you for the detailed summary. We just looked at the JGC last week and this in valuable info from someone who has already been there!

jcl · 04-29-2014, 10:27 AM

TerryG: Good post with excellent detail, thanks for posting.

Jeff

Jim Flower · 04-29-2014, 01:51 PM

Hi Terry,
It looks like we have almost the same oil temps on a climb. My average mileage turned out to be 14.6 m/us gal. May be low due to the new engine. Also maybe because I was a little heavier than you. I was driving at 63 mph. Looks like it can only get better. Have you found an easy source for DEF? Jim

ggoat!!! · 04-29-2014, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by terryg

during long hard pulls the coolant temp gauge will steadily climb to within 1 bar of the red zone and stay there. Likewise, the engine oil temp will climb to around 256 f and stay there.

yikes!!!

gmw photos · 04-29-2014, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ggoat!!!

yikes!!!

Well, yikes was my first reaction also. However, it may just be my old fashioned way of looking at these kinds of things....that being "cooler is better".
Having said that though, that is why I asked about the use of syn oil. I would think it would be certainly mandated, and apparently it is. If it were me, I would want to change it often, and have a Blackstone analysis done a few times to see how it looks.
Just as an aside, from my research and understanding, the reference temp that has traditionally been used for oil is 212 degrees F. At that target point, basic design decisions are made regarding flowability vs pumping and other capabilities.
It sounds like this engine may be designed to run at higher temps for perhaps the purpose of cleaner emissions and perhaps also lower fuel consumption.

From the limited ( so far ) report we have of these motors, it sounds like it's a very nice engine as for use and drive-ability. Finally we are getting some "nice size" diesel choices in the north american market. I wish Chrysler and the buyers well on this. If they do well, the others will follow.

terryg · 04-29-2014, 05:59 PM

Jim,

I've purchased DEF that meets Chrysler's spec. at our local Autozone. It sells for around $14.00 per 2.5 gal container w/spout.

Gmw Photos,

I agree with your recommendation to change the oil often. Chrysler says "up to 10,000 miles between oil changes. I've done two oil changes at 5000 mile intervals and am getting ready to do another one as I'm approaching 15,000 miles. A downside to the VM 3.0 engine is the cost of oil and filter. It uses a cartridge filter that sells anywhere from $45 to $60 currently. However, I have seen reports of some finding the filter online for as little as $30. The synthetic oil sells for around $9/qt. and the motor takes 8 quarts. My dealer is charging $99.00 for a oil/filter change and says he's doing it at a loss. The other local Chrysler dealer says he can't do it for less than $154 without losing money.

My only gripes so far with the Jeep are an annoying rattle in the overhead console (it's the sunglasses holder I think), and the poor Sirius/XM reception despite having the antenna replaced per a TSB addressing the issue. Oh yeah, I found out the hard way not to use the high capacity Diesel pumps with the large nozzles. It took less than a second to soak me with $0.29 cents worth of Diesel

gmw photos · 04-29-2014, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by terryg

Jim,

I've purchased DEF that meets Chrysler's spec. at our local Autozone. It sells for around $14.00 per 2.5 gal container w/spout.

Gmw Photos,

I agree with your recommendation to change the oil often. Chrysler says "up to 10,000 miles between oil changes. I've done two oil changes at 5000 mile intervals and am getting ready to do another one as I'm approaching 15,000 miles. A downside to the VM 3.0 engine is the cost of oil and filter. It uses a cartridge filter that sells anywhere from $45 to $60 currently. However, I have seen reports of some finding the filter online for as little as $30. The synthetic oil sells for around $9/qt. and the motor takes 8 quarts. My dealer is charging $99.00 for a oil/filter change and says he's doing it at a loss. The other local Chrysler dealer says he can't do it for less than $154 without losing money.

My only gripes so far with the Jeep are an annoying rattle in the overhead console (it's the sunglasses holder I think), and the poor Sirius/XM reception despite having the antenna replaced per a TSB addressing the issue. Oh yeah, I found out the hard way not to use the high capacity Diesel pumps with the large nozzles. It took less than a second to soak me with $0.29 cents worth of Diesel

Terry,
One would think that in time, the cost of the filters will come down. Hopefully.

As for the oil, I would be curious if Mobil 1 would meet the specs for this engine ? Do you have any knowledge of that ? I use it in my vehicles, and regularly buy it on sale in 5 qt containers at wally world for around $22.

As to the high flow nozzles at the truck stop....yes sir, I hear you. I often fuel the F350 there....and for sure I stand to the side and squeeze the lever with caution !

ggoat!!! · 04-29-2014, 06:56 PM

Here's hoping that the overheating Eco-diesel isn't another Pentastar failure waiting to happen...

Some people on the Jeep forums are having issues and blown head gaskets...

MY2014 diesel Grand cherokee overheating? - JeepForum.com

Here are some quotes:

"Good day,i bought a 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Diesel Overland.The vehicle has 5800 km on the clock and it overheats to a point that it goes into a limp mode and slows down to idle speed,this only happens during towing a boat or caravan.During the past weekend it happened to me while driving up a long uphill on cruise control set at 100 km/h.It gave a service electronic throttle alarm and the engine light came on and sustained.I took the vehicle to a dealer and the ecu had a fault "turbo over boost" which was reset by them.I then drove off and did not use cruise control and thus slowed down on uphills and managed to control the temp.It still came very close to the orange mark.The oil temp got to 264 and then dropped down after i took my foot off the accelerator.Please can you advise as to similar issues?"

"I have had similar problems. Our MY2014 GC Limited Diesel blew a head gasket first time it went on sand. They repaired under warranty, there have been a few issues since then to do with the cooling system (couple of leaking orings). Ever since then I've been very paranoid about the temperature. We had high temperature when towing our jayco caravan on bitumen, straight section of flat road. The dealer reports that is normal temps to see when towing but it's hard to know whether you're getting the truth or a story from the dealer so they don't have to deal with it further."

Jim Flower · 04-29-2014, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by terryg

Jim,

I've purchased DEF that meets Chrysler's spec. at our local Autozone. It sells for around $14.00 per 2.5 gal container w/spout.

Gmw Photos,

I agree with your recommendation to change the oil often. Chrysler says "up to 10,000 miles between oil changes. I've done two oil changes at 5000 mile intervals and am getting ready to do another one as I'm approaching 15,000 miles. A downside to the VM 3.0 engine is the cost of oil and filter. It uses a cartridge filter that sells anywhere from $45 to $60 currently. However, I have seen reports of some finding the filter online for as little as $30. The synthetic oil sells for around $9/qt. and the motor takes 8 quarts. My dealer is charging $99.00 for a oil/filter change and says he's doing it at a loss. The other local Chrysler dealer says he can't do it for less than $154 without losing money.

My only gripes so far with the Jeep are an annoying rattle in the overhead console (it's the sunglasses holder I think), and the poor Sirius/XM reception despite having the antenna replaced per a TSB addressing the issue. Oh yeah, I found out the hard way not to use the high capacity Diesel pumps with the large nozzles. It took less than a second to soak me with $0.29 cents worth of Diesel

Thank you Terry,
I have purchased DEF from my local Canadian Tire store for $20 in the same container. Although it is handy to use, I was just wondering if you had discovered availability when you were taking on fuel where it may be available in bulk and one could make one less trip to a store where he buys stuff he really doesn't need, which, according to my wife, is something that is only a male affliction.
Mobil1 ESP 5w30 meets the specifications for our diesels. I used the same oil in my 2008 Jeep Diesel and I used Mobil 1 in my previous Jeeps. The Synthetics really do seem to improve longevity but at a pretty steep price. Some guys on the Mercedes forums have figured out where to get both oil and filters on line at a much better price but I have forgotten where. I do my changes at 10,000 k since it's harder to forget.
I see that you have discovered that in some stations they put the truck nozzle on the outside and the car nozzle on the inside. They will eventually make improvements once more customers show up with Diesels. Jim

Bigventure · 04-29-2014, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Flower

Hi Terry,
It looks like we have almost the same oil temps on a climb. My average mileage turned out to be 14.6 m/us gal. May be low due to the new engine. Also maybe because I was a little heavier than you. I was driving at 63 mph. Looks like it can only get better. Have you found an easy source for DEF? Jim

My GC did its first regeneration at 5000 miles. It now breaths easy and my fuel economy went up a lot.

Bigventure · 04-29-2014, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmw photos

Terry,
One would think that in time, the cost of the filters will come down. Hopefully.

As for the oil, I would be curious if Mobil 1 would meet the specs for this engine ? Do you have any knowledge of that ? I use it in my vehicles, and regularly buy it on sale in 5 qt containers at wally world for around $22.

As to the high flow nozzles at the truck stop....yes sir, I hear you. I often fuel the F350 there....and for sure I stand to the side and squeeze the lever with caution !

I used a coupon at the dealer they did the oil change and tire rotation for $29.95! Yes it's the proper oil and filter. The filter was $60 retail.

Jim Flower · 05-01-2014, 05:51 PM

My GC came with 30k on the odometer but 16.8 hrs of running which would explain why the dealer had to do something to get the diesel exhaust filter unplugged. The Jeep sat in a holding facility near Detroit for 8 weeks during Feb., March, and April while the shipper tried to get his act together. The distance from the holding facility to the dealer was 5 hours tops. There seemed to be no exchange of information between the dealer and shipper. Since my driving to date has been 99% highway, I have seen no notification of regeneration taking place but it has gobbled up about 5 gallons of DEF. Man it's a beautiful engine. Jim

Jim Flower · 05-01-2014, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigventure

My GC did its first regeneration at 5000 miles. It now breaths easy and my fuel economy went up a lot.

One of these days, my iPad and I will learn how to work together. My previous post was in response to this quote. Jim

Bigventure · 05-01-2014, 06:00 PM

The regen actually happened when my wife was driving and she thought something was wrong and called me. It's her daily driver maybe she drive 10 miles a day. So that would explain the regen

Jim Flower · 05-01-2014, 07:01 PM

Yes, apparently they liked to be used. My wife put 25,000 k on her 2000 Jeep over a 10 year period. In November I had to replace the 10 year old tires which had no wear, due to age. When I gave her the Jeep in 2003 after I had used it for three years, it had 175,000 k on it. (Original tires and brakes) Being the good sport that I am, I did put new brakes and tires on it at that time just for her. In November we gave the Jeep with the new tires to my sister. Should keep her out of my hair for 10 years since she drives about the same amount as my wife. Jim

Bigventure · 05-01-2014, 07:07 PM

You must be from the south. Up here in ohio they like to use salt and you may get 10 years top before it's rotted out

Jim Flower · 05-01-2014, 07:20 PM

No. Canada. Ohio is south but our salt is about the same. I had to have the rocker panels replaced due to rust before we gave the Jeep to my sister. The 2000 Jeep was a replacement for the 1993 Jeep that I had given her but became a detriment to the neighbourhood as it rusted away in the driveway. The mechanics appear to out last the body. Jim

2012FB · 05-05-2014, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by terryg

During long hard pulls the coolant temp gauge will steadily climb to within 1 bar of the red zone and stay there. Likewise, the engine oil temp will climb to around 256 F and stay there.

This is the same experience I had on the test drive which is why this thread was started. So it would appear that the cooling issue was not fuel as suggested by the dealer and not a defective unit as suggested by others. This also confirms my suspicions as to why the dealer(s) ignored my questions challenging their explanation and my repeated requests to be put in contact with the regional Jeep rep.

The GC was my first choice and I was excited about it. If I was willing to go back to a truck, which I never will, the Dodge EcoDiesel would be my second choice. It is not an engine issue but an inadequate cooling design on the GC. I am confident the truck with tow mode and larger cooling system would be a great TV.

The rapid high heat and cooling cycles when towing are going to be the death of the engine. It is just a very unfortunate reality. I thought the more I test drove the GC the quicker the temp would rise which looking back I think it was due to heat soak on the engine and cooling system. This is too big an investment to run the risk in my book. Yes perhaps Jeep will honor the warranty to keep repairing the engine but who wants to go through that!

I did based on my serious concerns with the GC by the 2014 ML350 Bluetec and could not be more happier with it. We have towed Denver to Phoenix once and Denver to Breckenridge twice. The temp gage never moves. The engine is quiet and when stopping to refuel it is cool with no smells or temperature related crackling and popping.

On the GC I would roll the windows down and turn the interior heat to max high and make sure the AC is turned off as this might help a bit.

Best of wishes and happy towing.

rostam · 05-05-2014, 08:24 AM

This would have been caught in the testing phase had Chrsyler implemented the SAE towing standards (Sadly only Toyota has). One of tests require the TV to go up a grade with trailer in tow, 2 passengers, AC on, maintain a certain speed, and not overheat.

gmw photos · 05-05-2014, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rostam

This would have been caught in the testing phase had Chrsyler implemented the SAE towing standards (Sadly only Toyota has). One of tests require the TV to go up a grade with trailer in tow, 2 passengers, AC on, maintain a certain speed, and not overheat.

If I were a betting person, I'd bet it was "caught" anyway, and they decided that it was worth the roll of the dice. A further bet would say that the vast majority of folks that buy GC's even with a diesel will not be towing, so Chyrsler figures their exposure to warranty claims because of this issue is very limited. It's all about risk management to them. Which is different than "making it right for all the users" of a given product line.