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Old 04-11-2014, 10:11 PM   #1
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2004 Safari Rating Changes

Sorry, change was in 2005.

What happened to the Safari SS in 2004? In 2000-2003 and maybe before the UBW and GVWR for the Safari 25 queen and twin were the same as the SS. In 2004 the ratings on the SS went up 350# with no apparent change in the floor plan while the ratings on the queen and twin were unchanged.

Why do I care? I'm wondering what the limiting factor is in the 2001 Safari 25 twin is and what might be possible to increase the GVWR. My trailer was modded to replace the gaucho with storage and recliners and a significant portion of my cargo carrying capacity apparently disappeared. I have 3000# axles and when the time comes I would consider upgrading to 3500 or 4000# axles but I don't want to over stress the frame or shell.

Thanks,

Al
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Old 04-11-2014, 11:29 PM   #2
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Not sure how you are weighing. The weight carried by the tow vehicle receiver is not on your axles. So if you have 6000# total axle capacity and your trailer is 6000# standing alone, you have some additional load capacity when the tongue is on the receiver. And I wonder if the weight of the tires and wheels is considered part of the axle load capacity, as their weight is not carried on the axles either.
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Old 04-12-2014, 12:51 AM   #3
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Hi, I have a 2005 Safari and my trailer's GVWR is 6,300 lbs. Later in the year when they came out with the front bedroom models they upped the GVWR to 7,300 lbs. [same as the 2005 Classic] Earlier models like your's had 14" wheels and the later models like mine have 15" wheels. Also larger brakes. With 14" wheels they had 10" brakes and with the 15" wheels they have 12" brakes. Not sure if this helps you with your question.
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Old 04-12-2014, 04:20 AM   #4
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Unsprung weight not directly carried by the axles is not counted against the axle capacity. A 3000 pound axle with 3000 pounds showing at the scale really has about 2880 pounds carried by the axle.
And before anybody asks, i have checked pretty exhaustively, and can find no bearings or grease seals to adapt 12" hubs and drums to the spindles meant for 10" hubs and drums. There are 6 lug 10" drums, if you want to go with 15" wheels. They should cost less than a hundred dollars, if you want to spread out your axle upgrade over two or three seasons. You can get drums/wheels/tires one year, then axles a couple of years later, to lessen the load on your wallet.
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Old 04-12-2014, 09:27 AM   #5
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Doug- I weighed my trailer twice, once at a local moving and storage and once on CAT scales. The weights all correlated well. When I backed out everything that was not included in the factory's unloaded base weight (water, propane, etc,) I weighed 5481# vs: the factory spec of 4920. This includes the tongue weight, which with weight distribution on but not optimized, was 720#.

Doug, Bob, and Terry- I understand about unsprung weight, but per DOT standards, GVW is measured at the ground, I.e. The wheels and tongue jack. So the weight of the axles , wheels, tires, etc counts against GVWR, if not the axle load. And my trailer has 15" wheels and 12" brakes, apparently from the factory, based on the date code on the spare. Also the 2001 spec sheet says 15" wheels and 3000# axles.

All- After all is said and done, with only trailer equipment, e.g. full water, 1-1/2 tanks of propane, but no food, clothing, grill, generator, etc. I only have 380# of cargo capacity left. I believe my trailer is overweight by roughly 560#. At the same time I am trying to understand why and what might be done to improve the situation, like increasing axle ratings. Part of the problem appears to be a JC-installed mod to replace the front gaucho with some storage and two recliners. I have posted in another forum trying to ascertain the weight of a gaucho. The added furniture is about 350#.

Thanks for your information and suggestions.

Al
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Old 04-12-2014, 09:43 AM   #6
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If you have the axle capacity, and the frame isn't stressed, I wonder what difference GVWR makes unless you are towing commercially.
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Old 04-12-2014, 02:09 PM   #7
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I was looking at GVWR as a possible indication of frame strength. I don't know what the limiting factor is. Others have stated that the monocoque construction provides strength. From the parts lists it looks like in 2005 they put heavier duty (3800#) axles on the 25s except the fb, and raised the GVWR on them to 7000#, but I don't know if they did anything else. Two axles increased 800# for a total of 1600# but the GVWR only went up 700#. Maybe that's an indication of the limits of the frame. Maybe JC can shed some light.

Unloaded except for a full water tank I had 5200# on the axles and 720# on the tongue. I'd like to crank in a little more WD since the front axle was 200# lighter than just the truck alone.

I'm perhaps being overly conservative but I'd like to be under all gross weight ratings. Gcvwr is no problem but the individual GVWR for the TT and TV are close.

Thanks,

Al
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Old 04-12-2014, 03:32 PM   #8
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If you would like to be under gross weight ratings then you have to lighten the trailer or lighten the load until you get the number you need.

Pack lightly, get water and food, firewood when you arrive. Most people carry three or four times the clothing they actually use. Do you really need lots of tools. Lightweight kitchen and dining equipment. How many ways are you equipped to cook food.

Put the trailer spare tire in the truck or leave it at home, Airstream says you can run on three with their cautions. Lighter reclining chairs perhaps, they sound heavy. Do you really need a lot of tools along.

It all adds up.
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