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Old 10-24-2016, 09:07 AM   #1
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11.8 in wheelbase impacts 33% increase towing??

I'll try to be somewhat brief, but a bit of background. I took 2015 off and spent it traveling the country in a 2015 27FB EB and a 2015 Ram 2500. Awesome experience, and the truck trailer combo were awesome. Alas, back to work, at least for a few years, so I sold the truck/trailer combo. The Ram 2500 just wasn't a daily driver, especially up here in Boston.

I'm looking for a daily driver (4x4) and in the back of my mind I'm thinking that perhaps in a few years I'll take another year off and repeat the trip. It would be nice if my daily driver could be used for that trip as well. I really like the 26U which tops out at 7,600 lbs.

My ideal truck is the 2017 Ford Raptor. I know its not an ideal tow vehicle, but my trip consisted of driving to one location (like Moab) and staying for weeks or months on end, so I'm OK with just average performance. Here's the part that I'm struggling to understand:

There are two models of the Raptor

Super Cab:
134.2 in wheelbase
5,525 curb weight
6,000 lb towing capacity


Super Crew:
146.0 in wheelbase
5,697 curb weight
8,000 lb towing capacity

So for 150 lbs of weight and 11.8 inches of length the towing capacity goes from 6,000 to 8,000??? Everything else is the same, engine, transmission, etc.

I'd really like to get the Super Cab but its technically not rated for the 26U and I'm just trying to understand why such a large jump....

Below is the link to the towing specs:

http://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/specifications/towing/

Any idea on why the large change in towing capacity???
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Old 10-24-2016, 09:17 AM   #2
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11.8 in wheelbase impacts 33% increase towing??

Base-

I can't answer you're question specifically in regards to the Raptor model differences.

However, in general terms normally the heavier the truck and more equipment it has correlates to the less it will tow and haul for payload. It looks like perhaps the super cab versus super crew has some other difference like suspension or engine or gear ratio in the rear end giving it less capability than the crew. Or you transposed the numbers 😌.

We are forever debating half ton trucks and their capabilities on AF so welcome to the show! I hope this helps.


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Old 10-24-2016, 09:50 AM   #3
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Probably has little to do with wheelbase, just different axle ratios for each, which will change the towing capacity.
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Old 10-24-2016, 10:02 AM   #4
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Same motor in both? Sounds like one has the larger V8.
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Old 10-24-2016, 11:21 AM   #5
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Both have the same motor:
High-Output 3.5L Ecoboost V6: 450 hp

Both have the same torque 510 @ 3500

Both have the same 10 speed transmission

Both list the exact same chassis specs

Payload only has a 200 lb difference

I don't see any options to change the gear ratios...

As far as I can tell, its the exact same truck, just a foot longer.
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Old 10-24-2016, 11:35 AM   #6
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Might be that the Ford engineers think the longer wheelbase is more stable and therefore more towing capacity.
You could call Andy at Can Am and have a discussion about it
He would certainly shed some intelligent Light!
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Old 10-24-2016, 11:35 AM   #7
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Could be that ford's info is not up to date where you are looking. It's a very new truck.
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Old 10-24-2016, 11:44 AM   #8
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Are the tires exactly the same on both trucks?
My tv is a Ram Promaster 1500 Van. It came with 225/75R 16 C 121/120R M&S Load Range E Continental tires. I want to replace the tires with same size Michelin LT Load range E tires but they have a load index of 115. Although the Michelin tire selector says they are a fit, no reputable tire retailer will install them and warranty them on my van. There are warnings that restrict installing lighter duty tires than OEM. I believe the vehicle designers may have spec'ed different tires on the two trucks you are comparing. Probably for desired ride characteristics.
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Old 10-24-2016, 12:32 PM   #9
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Can't comment specifically on those two models but the only thing I can say is that for the last three tow vehicles I have owned, each one had longer wheelbase than its predecessor and each change resulted in a towing experience that I found more relaxing and just felt safer.

But I can certainly understand your preference for a shorter vehicle for everyday use. Our truck is also our daily driver and at times can be a bit of a pig for parking, but our decision was to tolerate that in light of the towing experience.

Our wheelbase is 153", about 10" longer than the previous truck we owned.


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Old 10-24-2016, 01:25 PM   #10
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You have sold your AS and truck, save the money for your next adventure and buy a small all wheel vehicle for your daily driver around Boston until you are ready to go again. You already know that the ideal way for long hauls pulling an AS greater than 25 foot is using a 3/4 ton truck or van
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Old 10-24-2016, 01:48 PM   #11
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The raptor wasn't built with towing in mind it has a soft suspension with more travel. That wouldn't be my choice for either a daily driver or a tow vehicle.
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Old 10-24-2016, 03:48 PM   #12
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Also consider the effects of, and on, payload. Subtract the tongue weight (nominally 10%-15% of 7600#) from payload and compare that to what you plan to carry, driver, passengers, and cargo in the truck bed. Then subtract the weight of passengers and anything you carry in the truck from the towing capacity. It's easy to get on the wrong side of marginal with a trailer in that weight class.

Al
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Old 10-24-2016, 04:39 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BASE729 View Post
Any idea on why the large change in towing capacity???
Ford publishes payloads of 1000 lbs and 1200 lbs, for the respective Raptor models. Pretty low.

They also publish GVWRs that suggest the vehicles will weigh 5600 to 5800 lbs on the road.

Then they publish a GCVWR that is the same for each model, 12,000 lbs.

Put simply, given the published GCVWR and the curb weight, it appears to be impossible to have a tow rating of 8000 lbs. Unless you remove around 2000 lbs of base truck weight somehow.

My money is on a typo on the tow rating.

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Old 10-24-2016, 05:26 PM   #14
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I agree. This is a new vehicle and Ford documentation probably has a typo. Given that the vehicle curb weight is over 5000#, and GCWR is only 12,000#, cannot see how it can tow 8000# (6000# is more likely). Also, as others have said a specialized off road vehicle usually does not make a good tow vehicle. Suspension, tires, etc that are good for off road are usually not so good for towing, and payload numbers in such vehicles are also pretty low.
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Old 10-24-2016, 07:52 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BASE729 View Post
I'll try to be somewhat brief, but a bit of background. I took 2015 off and spent it traveling the country in a 2015 27FB EB and a 2015 Ram 2500. Awesome experience, and the truck trailer combo were awesome. Alas, back to work, at least for a few years, so I sold the truck/trailer combo. The Ram 2500 just wasn't a daily driver, especially up here in Boston.

I'm looking for a daily driver (4x4) and in the back of my mind I'm thinking that perhaps in a few years I'll take another year off and repeat the trip. It would be nice if my daily driver could be used for that trip as well. I really like the 26U which tops out at 7,600 lbs.

My ideal truck is the 2017 Ford Raptor. I know its not an ideal tow vehicle, but my trip consisted of driving to one location (like Moab) and staying for weeks or months on end, so I'm OK with just average performance. Here's the part that I'm struggling to understand:

There are two models of the Raptor

Super Cab:
134.2 in wheelbase
5,525 curb weight
6,000 lb towing capacity


Super Crew:
146.0 in wheelbase
5,697 curb weight
8,000 lb towing capacity

So for 150 lbs of weight and 11.8 inches of length the towing capacity goes from 6,000 to 8,000??? Everything else is the same, engine, transmission, etc.

I'd really like to get the Super Cab but its technically not rated for the 26U and I'm just trying to understand why such a large jump....

Below is the link to the towing specs:

http://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/specifications/towing/

Any idea on why the large change in towing capacity???
6000/8000 lbs. tow Rating???????
I have a 2015 F-150, Super Crew, 3.5L EcoBoost, 3.55 final drive, 4X4, with 5.5 Ft. Box.
This animal is rated to tow 12,200 lbs. with tow package.
And it tows a 30' FC. that gross's at 8800 lb. I generally tow at about 8000 lb. +/- a little, and the Ford handles it rather well.
So what's with this 6000/8000 lb. routine?
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Old 10-24-2016, 08:07 PM   #16
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It was a truck that has been modified to be a toy.


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Old 10-24-2016, 10:52 PM   #17
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Quote:
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It was a truck that has been modified to be a toy.
Yup. And a toy with soft, long travel suspension and off road tires, and thus reduced lateral stability.
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:25 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by jcl View Post
Yup. And a toy with soft, long travel suspension and off road tires, and thus reduced lateral stability.

Sounds good to me!

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