Reputable Dealer, I wonder

[smily]

How about this for a reputable dealer?

I cannot believe a Dealership that claims that it is the largest preowned RV dealer ship. This outfit is selling on EBAY.
this is their pitch.

"We are Edited to prevent anger largest pre-owned RV dealer. We Do Not know what works and Does not Work on This Travel Trailer. It Is Being Sold AS-IS! Please call for Details.Thank you!"

Now a dealer that resells used or new RVs, in my opinion, would be willing to test and disclose problems with an RV. You will not be successful reselling anything in volume if you do not know what you are selling.

I would cautiously expect this from an individual, but a Dealership

Come on guys, wake up. We know that you know what the problems are..........

Smily

[markdoane]

Smily,

Sounds like you need to get your own dealership, then you can run it the way YOU want.

I think most people understand what "AS-IS" means and will bid accordingly.

[smily]

You are absolutely right, When I get a dealership.

But this is a forum and a forum that welcomes many opinions including yours.

I am merely stating that I wonder why a reputable dealership would not make the effort to identify the product they are selling.

Most any product sold used is "as-is"

IMHO, When people buy from individuals, they typically realize that they are tasked with identifying the problems with the product. When people buy from dealerships, (typically) they expect a business to be professional and competent in selling their product. Some folks will even pay more for that convenience.

It is just me, I suspect there are others, when I go to a "Dealership", I expect them to know their product. I will compare it to Radio Shack(TM) often, the buyer knows more about the product than the sales person. You must admit this is frustrating to most consumers.
I believe that opinion has been expressed from consumers of new Airstreams. It is frustrating going to dealership, that knows less than you do about the product.

Now answer me this, if you were selling this unit on EBAY, would you put a little more effort in the discovery process? I have partcipated as a victim and prosecution of "reputable" car dealerships selling Lemmons. There are laws against this in many states. Let me tell you this from experience, turning your head and not going through the discovery process in reselling used items will not relieve you of the responsibility of selling lemmons.

Just ask FORD. It cost them plenty for reselling used cars that they chose not to perform discovery and inspections. The bar is raised when a dealership resells products professionally. They are expected due diligance that is higher than say an individual who is selling something they do not profess to be a dealer of.

Just my opinion though

Smily

[markdoane]

Smily,

Your points are cogent and well made.

I guess I was thinking more of this deal as a 'trade-in' sort of thing, where the dealer just wanted to get it off his hands with as little effort as possible.

Just like auto dealers that auction off the beaters they take in trade, and don't want cluttering up their lot.

Of course those auto auctions operate in a different environment. Most auctioned off cars end up on boats headed to third world countries.

I see eBay as performing many functions, including disposal of distressed merchandise.

I still think the dealer made a fair effort to represent the trailer in it's true condition. The range is missing, there's a big rip in the belly, and it has 'space for a refrigerator'.

[smily]

You hit the nail on the head.
I read that listing and thought to myself, now these folks have spent some time looking this unit over and they posted the results of that.

I cant help but think that while they were in the discovery process, they did not check some if not all of the systems.

Think about it, if they knew the A/C or anything else worked, dont you think they would say so, it would improve the bids. I would think that they would want to verify all systems, because the better the unit, the better the sales price.

With benefit of the doubt, you are probably right , this may be a dealer that is just rolling it across the lot.

I just find myself expecting more from a dealership of that magnitude. "The Largest Pre Owned RV Dealer".

I am curious enough that I may call them and ask for the details they said are available on the phone. Why dont they post ALL details on the EBAY site?

As I said, I have been a victim and I guess I just have a sore spot for dealerships who claim "We are not aware"

Smily

[qqq]

Who said they are "reputable"

Hart

[Silvertwinkie]

Hey and it's not just these dealers. It also is some of the factory authorized folks as well.

Case in point:

Q: "Where is the fire extinguisher?"
A: "It doesn't come with one."

Called Airstream as this appeared strange. It turns out it is an RVIA code to have a fire extinguisher in the coach. The factory sent me one.

Q:"Where is the Airstream floor mat?"
A:"It doesn't come with one."
Q:"Really? It shows it in this list I have off the Airstream website and it is in all the pictures."
A: "No, it doesn't come with one."

The factory also sent me the entry mat.


Q: "The sales brochure says it has an 18gal black tank, the web says 8 gallons and the window sticker says 8 gallons. What is the correct answer?"
A: "It has an 8 gallon tank."
Q: "Are you sure?
A: "Yes, I called the factory."

I called the factory and they told me that the change was made earlier and that it had an 18gal black tank.



Q: "Where is the water tank and pump?"
A: " Under the rear Bambi bed."

The reality is that both the tank and the pump on the dinette 19' Bambis are on the roadside dinette seat.


Q: "The fridge fan on the coil appears to be broken."
A: "Oh, that's nothing, I'll pop the blade back on."

The fan never worked for the 10 months I owned the coach.


Q: "The seat cushions seem a bit warn as this was a show model, would you be willing to replace the seats cusions?"
A: "Yes."

The dealer in fact sent seat cushion covers, and that was great, however the cushions themselves were kind of beat(sqashed) on the ends you can view them here:

http://www.motorhomestraveltrailers....rch.asp?vn=air

Click on the used '03 19' Bambi

Q: "On sales tax, are you collecting the county tax too and sending it on?"
A: "This is the total price. There should be no other costs involoved outside of renewing you tags. We've rolled everything into the loan outside of your downpayment."

The reality was that the costs were not included as I had thought and the county I live in hit me up for a bit over a grand.

When it came time to look for the new Safari, I shopped around which I feel is any consumer's right. This guy got kind of pissy about it. He started the used car sales stuff about how places that low ball wouldn't be around much longer an that his service department takes care of his customers first (even though his service department is small and not very customer focused).

Oh and by the way, this is the same dealer that had a 16' CCD on his lot. A forum member locally went down there to take a look at it. He happened to also write down the VIN number. The same person went to the local RV show the dealer was at several months later.

The person asked, "is this the same CCD that I saw when I was down at your place?"

"No! We've sold many of these since then."

So he again wrote down the VIN number of the unit at the show and when he got home, the VINs as you might have guessed were identical.


I'll admit that Ken's sounds worse, however, it's not totally limited to a few select dealers...the factory authorized folks can be bad too.

[markdoane]

Originally posted by qqq
Who said they are "reputable"

Hart

I would be willing to reserve judgment on their 'reputability' until I had dealt with them. They do have a good e-bay rating.

And they call themselves the largest used RV dealer in name of state edited out, not the whole world.

Let's not conclude that all RV dealers are disreputable. Some are. Some aren't. Some we don't have enough data.

All I can tell by his listing is that he showed some of the defects, and claimed it is 'ready for restoration'. Sounds like another half-finished project by PO.

[smily]

Markdoane,

Thats great damage control

Good that you got that out there before the west coast signs in and riddles us with a barrage of defensive "protect the dealers" countermeasures.

You are correct that stereotyping is bad and always do your own homework. Derive your own opinions based on actual interaction.

The intent of my post was to speak to all dealerships and ask, (recommend) absolute disclosure is paramount in retail.

Smily

[markdoane]

Originally posted by smily
Markdoane,

The intent of my post was to speak to all dealerships and ask, (recommend) absolute disclosure is paramount in retail.

Smily

Very well said, Smily.
I agree completely. I'm glad you edited the dealers name out, now it is fair.

I have no dealings with the dealer in question. I've never been in the state he lives in. I have never bought or sold anything on eBay (although I do own stock in eBay).

I just want to be fair and not indict any particular dealer.

I still think he made a fair representation of what he is selling.

[Stefrobrts]

I think anytime I see a trailer for sale and the owner/seller says they don't know what works, that automatically tells me it doesn't, and so you should offer accordingly. I also don't understand why someone wouldn't try to get things working and test them out, as it could mean a lot more money for the item.

BTW, not all auction vehicles end up in third-world countries. Our E150 was auctioned twice and went through about five different dealership/broker's hands before we bought it. The funny thing was it had been traded in to a dealer by someone in our own town, and we bought it two hours away in another state. I guess it was just old enough and high enough miles that no one wanted it on their lot, because it's a pretty nice truck, really. It was surprising to see how much it had been passed around in the few months prior to us buying it - that was kind of an eye opener for me as to how dealerships work.

[markdoane]

Stephanie,

I was in al-Khobar Saudi Arabia a few years ago, and I was amazed at how much 'U S Iron' I saw.

Many of them had the original dealer stickers on them. Mostly big old Bel-Aires and Suburbans.

Cedar Rapids Iowa.
Duluth Minnesota.
Cincinnati Ohio.

. . . to name a few.

[Stefrobrts]

That's amazing. A friend sent me a european magazine dedicated to American cars (there was an AS article in it), and it had all these pictures readers had sent in of old cars still being used everyday in Turkey and Romania. Who would think? They have quite an enthusiast following over there, in addition to the folks who just use them as cheap transportation.

[Tinsel Loaf]

Most of the sellers (sales people) are just out to make a buck. If you don't do your homework your just their next mark. If you do your homework well.....
Ya payes ya money and ya take your chances.

[actioncraft]

I would have to say that it does not matter whether you are dealing with a dealer or an owner, at the end of the day it is "buyer be ware" and buyer you are on your own. Case in point; I just purchased a used Airstream and was told by the previous owner that everything was in working order and ready to go before purchasing and starting for a long road trip (1,500 miles) which included stopping on the way home for a camping outing/shake down trip with several other families on the way home. I was told before purchasing the Airstream that everything was in as new condition or as new condition and being new/naive I asked the questions and got the answers I wanted to hear but did not know what to look for when I picked up my Airstream. It was not until we spent the first night in my new purchase did I realize that the Airstream had A/C, electrical problems, plumbing issues, water heater did not work and other smaller problems would plague us because the previous owner told us everything works "I promise" was the last words I heard. Unfortunately, in the internet world we live in today everything is buyer be ware; sold as is. I guess I still live in the golden days and thats why I decided to buy a classic Airstream. Don't get me wrong I love my new toy, I just hope that this Forum continues to promote stong values and we all promote high ethical values. Unfortunately, used dealers and e-bay are always going to bring out the uninvited.

[LLB21]

I would rather hear "as is" than yes everything works. Most time it doesn't.

[silver suz]

This worrys me a little as I'm about to put a whole bunch of stuff for sale (like the interior of a 1971 31' airstream) for sale. We started gutting it the day it arrived so I don't know if things work or not, We plugged the fridge in to make cold sodas- but have no idea if anything else works. I suspect everything does, because the individual we bought it from, went out of his way to make everything right including buying new lightbulbs, and a couple of lights. So how should I phrase the value of everything? For instance the whole back bath is being sold, as a unit. I dont think it had a shower curtain, but everything else looks fine. We just want this stuff gone and we dont have the time to check everything else out. So what should the wording be? "As is"? silver suz