75 Overlander Improvements Journal

[ALUMINUMINUM]

Always enlightened by the latest episode of “75 Overlander Improvements Journal”. Getting all that plastic aligned and riveted with only two hands is an accomplishment. It's surely better than new.

[Joyflea]

David , it looks great . Good problem solving.
Blue

[chrisetmike]

Looking good! Bathrooms are always easier to get out than put back in lol.

[dbj216]

My goodness, thank you folks.

I'm happy you like what's going on in my trailer. No Airstream work today as we cared for the 16 month old grandson all day to day. That is a delight.

David

[dbj216]

Today was the big test. Well, for me anyway. I pressurized the new plumbing after connecting the shower valve and bathtub drain. It was a "water test" of the pressure side and the drain side. Well, how did I do?

I got a "B". I had one of 7 connections leak. A "A" grade is no leaks found. The leak was a flex hose to the shower "pipe" through the tub wall. I didn't get the connection tight enough as I think the threads were a bit "oversized" and the nut took some torque to turn.

I had no leaks in the bathtub, tub drain assembly, trap, piping or grey tank connections. ABS glued fittings are almost mistake proof. I have the grey tank 30% full (according to the SeeLevel instrument) as I pumped quite a bit of water into the tub during my tests.

I need to go get a new rubber ducky for the tub. The old fishing bobber demonstrates water in the tub.

I did this test with the bath plastics held in by clecos as I sure didn't want to drill out rivets if I had a leak.

My "battery box external storage compartment" was a handy place to look for leaks. I removed my "easy to remove" compartment walls and I had access to the shower valve (need long arms) and I could see the bottom of the tub.

I have several more plumbing leak tests to do e.g. bath vanity, toilet, galley sink, black tank, etc.

Next step, well I'll think of something...

David

[Atomic_13]

Good strategy. I’m learning from you. Thanks.

[MsRivet]

Great work dbj216! I give you a B+.

There is always something else. It never ends!!!

[Joyflea]

Rubber ducky your the one . You make bath time so much..........

[dbj216]

Everyone has had a rubber ducky or two in their youth. Airstream was certainly big on bathtubs for many years. Maybe a feature that sold more trailers. I don't think Airstream installs a bathtub in any of there trailers anymore. They take a lot of room, and they use a lot of water. Mine will be used as an oversized shower pan.

Thanks all for your kind comments. They do keep a guy motivated.

After all night, no water on the floor today from the new grey tank. A good thing.

I've decided to use 5/32 rivets instead of 4/32 for assembly. The holes in the plastic bath parts are too worn oversized to use the 4/32 (1/8) size. I will squeeze them gently as I don't want to crack or crush the old plastic parts. I'm still considering tri-fold rivets. Seems like plastic parts would be a good application. They have less clamp force than pop rivets, and much less than bucked solid rivets (depending on how hard you hammer them).

One thing I noticed in my test was the bathtub drains rather slowly. It doesn't burp so I don't think it is vent issue. I do think it is the fact that I am draining in a slightly sloped pipe for about 5 feet with little "head pressure", or water weight with an inch of water in the tub. It does drain fast enough to drain away the flow from the shower valve. Originally the tub drained directly into a whopping 10 gallon grey water tank right below the bath.

David

[Jeremy9107]

Congrats on the mostly dry leak test. Things are looking good update if you figure out the slow drain issue. I’m concerned about that being an issue for me given the awkward venting from my tanks. Gotta love that 10 gallon gray tank. Perfect for a good bird bath.

[Joyflea]

In plumbing a1/4” per foot slope is standard but not more because solidify may not drain . Hard to get that from a tub in an AS bath especially if trailer is not level or leaning in your advantage. Good luck , a problem that’s been in the back of my mind . No leaks feels good . Blue

[dbj216]

I'm not too concerned about the drain rate of the tub as the drain can handle the shower valve flow, which is what, 1.5 gallon a minute?.

Here is a photo of the new tub drain pipe routing to the black tank. The pipe is in the space below the tub and above the floor. The vertical ABS pipe is the tub drain vent.

This old photo was taken before I relocated the converter and removed the brittle old battery box. I make an external storage area in this space.

And here is a photo of the old drain pipe I took out. The angled pipe with the hose clamp is the grey tank vent, and the very dusty line behind it is the tub drain line is the pipe from the trap that dumps to the grey tank close to the vent location. You can see it was originally a much shorter drain pipe.

The new 25 gallon grey tank is in the next frame bay forward, thus the need for the long pipe.

David

[dbj216]

I spent the afternoon removing silicone caulk from the bath extrusions. These pieces cover the seams between bath plastics and the line of rivets holding them together.

I haven't figured out what Airstream intended with these extrusions. They have a "lip" on them at the top. It is designed with a bevel on the inside edge as if Airstream intended to make a "fillet" caulk bead at the top. But the extrusion does not lay flat against the plastic part, see photo. And the extrusions are applied to the plastic parts with rivets. Since they don't lay flat, they tend to bend in due to the clamp force of the rivets. It appears the plastic parts are held together to a large extent by the rivets going through the extruded moldings and then the two pieces of plastic being joined together.

They would make more sense to me if they were installed "upside down" with the lip at the bottom edge of the plastic parts being assembled. Then the extrusion would lay flat and tight to the plastic part. It would be easier to seal this way. I can't easily flip them over as the extrusions are already bent to fit the bath parts.

There are 8 extruded moldings in the bath of the Overlander, see photo.

Just confused

David

[dbj216]

These plastic parts are kicking my rear end. Maybe it was a mistake to keep these original parts. My problems are the new shower wall I made that is sightly thicker (.100"), the bath platform may have some hand made variation in it, and just inexperience working with these "less than precise" parts. Nothing seems to fit well.

I made a new "stiffener" for the bottom of the sink vanity, I installed a new faucet and drain assembly in it. I also assembled the vanity to the shower "shelf" and the tub surround under the vanity. I finally got it all in there and looking reasonable. I can tell you it is a tight fit and the plastic is stressed, not relaxed like I would like. This may lead to cracks in the future, kinda like the plastic interior end caps usually get.

Next up is the under the vanity shelf, and the surrounds in front of the tub and below the vanity. I also will connect the new faucet and drain and test for leaks. I have to install the moldings and then caulk all the seams.

All this work to fix the rear end separation. I can sure understand why people cut "elephant ears" in the rear exterior skins to gain access to the rear body bolts and hold down plate. Would be much easier.

Am I still having fun? I think so but today I'm not so sure.

David

[Joyflea]

David , I saw a guy spray foam on the back of the plastic and left a gapin places to allow moisture to escape . It really made everything stiffer . I’m new to this so I don’t know the downside . His is five years old and he said he happy with it . Blue

[dbj216]

Joyflea: You are right. The right spray foam can make plastic parts a lot stiffer. The last factory I worked in injected spray foam insulation in molded picnic coolers. They had amazing strength and amazing ability to keep things cold in the hot sun. The glued on plywood will be adequate for my needs.

I continue to work on re-assembling the bath in my Overlander. I'm working on the plastics "floor support" which is just a piece of plywood that fits between the plastic and the floor under the sink. This piece separates the bath from the very small rear storage compartment. This piece also supports a tambor horizontal cabinet door that opens to the toilet paper holder. I'm rebuilding that cabinet shelf too. It isn't difficult, but a lot of messing around.

After that I have to rebuild the wall behind the toilet. The trailer had a goofy padded "clothes hamper" door that hinged down, and a goofy padded seat that folded out to rest over the toilet. My renovation won't include these luxury features. I will just have an easily removal panel so I can access the plumbing behind it. My new Thetford toilet is a different height that the original one. The original one was shot like the faucets were.

I'll just keep plugging away at this bath. Someday I might even get it done.

David

[J. Morgan]

Originally Posted by dbj216

I spent the afternoon removing silicone caulk from the bath extrusions. These pieces cover the seams between bath plastics and the line of rivets holding them together.



I haven't figured out what Airstream intended with these extrusions. They have a "lip" on them at the top. It is designed with a bevel on the inside edge as if Airstream intended to make a "fillet" caulk bead at the top. But the extrusion does not lay flat against the plastic part, see photo. And the extrusions are applied to the plastic parts with rivets. Since they don't lay flat, they tend to bend in due to the clamp force of the rivets. It appears the plastic parts are held together to a large extent by the rivets going through the extruded moldings and then the two pieces of plastic being joined together.



They would make more sense to me if they were installed "upside down" with the lip at the bottom edge of the plastic parts being assembled. Then the extrusion would lay flat and tight to the plastic part. It would be easier to seal this way. I can't easily flip them over as the extrusions are already bent to fit the bath parts.



There are 8 extruded moldings in the bath of the Overlander, see photo.



Just confused



David

Having pulled and replaced those extrusions a couple of times on my 75 Sovereign, my opinion is that they just don’t fit really well. Not by modern standards anyway.

By the way, your painted fixtures look nice!

[dbj216]

J Morgan: You are right. The extruded molding don't fit all that well. I feel they would fit better if they were mounted the other way around, with the lip against the edge being "hidden". The main purpose of the molding is hiding the rivet line when the bath parts are assembled.

Thanks for the complement on the painted plastics. I hear toilet white is all the rage in bath decorating. My trailer is nothing compared to your woodworking work of art.

David

[dbj216]

I cut a board as a "wall" between the bath and the rear storage compartment. I have completely reconfigured the holding tank plumbing for more waste water capacity and for a stronger rear subfloor. Here is a photo of all the "stuff" in the rear cargo compartment as Airstream built it rendering it useless, and maybe you can see all the subfloor penetrations which significantly weaken this important area of an Airstream trailer.

The "wall" divider will also provide support for the plastic bath vanity and the bath vanity storage compartment.

Here is a photo of the "new" rear storage compartment. My oak board patch back there is stronger and doesn't have any plumbing penetrations. The rear storage area is very small, but at least I can store a flashlight and a pair of pliers back there.

David

[dbj216]

Horizontal tambor doors required a bit of thought after I ripped them out. (That was easy.) It is very important the upper track is parallel to the lower track. Both tracks are attached to parts not related to each other. The upper one is riveted to the floppy plastic bath vanity, and the lower track is attached to a divider wall between the bath and rear storage area.

When a bath is torn out and rebuilt, many dimensions change. I replaced the subfloor under this area. I built a new bathtub platform which is likely just a bit different. I installed a new "shower wall" that was a bit thicker. All these changes affect the re-assembly process. And floppy plastic parts are not known for their precision by any means.

I found the distance between the top and bottom tambor door tracks had shrunk about a 1/4". I found it kinda difficult to get an accurate measurement between the tambor groove in the upper track and the groove in the lower track. I took a guess, and then hand fitted a "gage" made from a scrap piece of laminate and sanded it down until it fit nicely and would slide easily the whole length of the tambor tracks. I will adjust the tambor material accordingly to the dimension of the "gage" I made.

It just might work. I'll let you know how it goes.

I also made a new shelf for the vanity storage compartment. The toilet paper dispenser is located in this compartment. Airstream had a piece of aluminum behind this shelf, but I saw no need for it. I bet it was there so the storage compartment could be assembled on a subassembly bench, and then carried into the trailer.

David