Sealing the top of windows

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Shawnna

What clear sealant do I need to use?

Clear "silicone sealer".

Andy

[ALUMINUMINUM]

Hi Andy,


I'm curious about the history of the 66-68 Philips-Corning/Airstream relationship. One of my too many interests is glass. I've had a glass kiln for 15 years, and have experience with fusion, mold making, annealing and such. I considered making my own window but preferred to find an original. That took three years of searching. Why?? For me, it was the logo. I'm the guy that can't have un-matching windows in his restoration. It isn't an obsession, just an order of detail.


I know you have a vein of sensitivity about the replacement windows, and I have read every post about them. I don't fit into the debate as I have never held the replacement glass in my hand and am unable to make a physical or molecular comparison. What I understand from your posts and others is that the thickness is different, the temper is different, and the logo is different. I would guess that what also differs are the ratios of glass formers, flint, sand, quartz, Potash,fluxes, coefficient of expansion, heat ramps....
By different, I didn't mean inferior. In fact, the replacement window could be superior to whatever Airstream specified. I can't imagine that AS went to Corning and asked for the finest glass that money can buy. It was more likely “Furnish the cheapest glass that you're willing to put your name on.”


I'm a bit fascinated by the design expectation that the glass has to bend just enough to evenly compress the seal. That's not an easy task, and I wonder if Corning was funded by AS to R&D it fully. Or was it Philips that specified the design to Corning? Anybody know?? or care?


Anyway, It was late, I was tired of editing myself, and felt that supporting the statement was secondary to my point of Corning window preservation. Honestly, It did occur to me that “not the same” might ruffle someone's feathers.


Thanks for the opportunity to clarify my statement. Thanks even more for sharing your wisdom and all the support you offer. You school a lot of us.

[Shawnna]

Thank You Andy and Aluminuminum! I appreciate your schooling, help, patience, understanding and explanations! I have found very helpful information on this board and wouldn't even know where to begin if it were not for the experts and guidance of people who are very passionate about their trailers. I hope that everyone who can use and enjoying their trailers are doing so, as I can hardly wait till my first night out in mine.

[ALUMINUMINUM]

Ms S
I couldn't list or recommend all the solvents, carcinogens, abrasives, rouges, pickers, strippers, scrapers, waxes, penetrants, brushes, buffers, polishers... needed for prep and finish work. Decide what's chemically safe for you to use.
Clear sealant?? Could be an aluminum friendly silicone, or a flexible clear poly-something? I have no experience with flexible clears for Airstream exteriors.
There's a variety of suitable sealants and applicators that folks use on the shell. These are what I chose.
Happy Trails, Wm

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by ALUMINUMINUM

Ms S
I couldn't list or recommend all the solvents, carcinogens, abrasives, rouges, pickers, strippers, scrapers, waxes, penetrants, brushes, buffers, polishers... needed for prep and finish work. Decide what's chemically safe for you to use.
Clear sealant?? Could be an aluminum friendly silicone, or a flexible clear poly-something? I have no experience with flexible clears for Airstream exteriors.
There's a variety of suitable sealants and applicators that folks use on the shell. These are what I chose.
Happy Trails, Wm

Interesting.

I measured an old Phillips window made by Corning.

It measured .112 inches thick.

I also measured the replacements and they are all .125 inches thick.

The curvature of the new windows, that we have, matches the original aluminum metal frame within 1/16 of an inch.

Certainly, then there is zero problems with it's fit.

Upgrading it's installation using the "D" gasket assures a "non leaking" window, other than possibly the window hinge, which is an easy fix.

Andy

[Shawnna]

Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In

Interesting.



I measured an old Phillips window made by Corning.



It measured .112 inches thick.



I also measured the replacements and they are all .125 inches thick.



The curvature of the new windows, that we have, matches the original aluminum metal frame within 1/16 of an inch.



Certainly, then there is zero problems with it's fit.



Upgrading it's installation using the "D" gasket assures a "non leaking" window, other than possibly the window hinge, which is an easy fix.



Andy

Thank you again Andy! I'm sorry for my ignorance but I have a Newbie
Question.. Do you use the same manufactures as VTS for your replacement windows and stainless steel window clips? I'm merely asking because I think that is something to be considered when we are ordering replacement parts.

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Shawnna

Thank you again Andy! I'm sorry for my ignorance but I have a Newbie
Question.. Do you use the same manufactures as VTS for your replacement windows and stainless steel window clips? I'm merely asking because I think that is something to be considered when we are ordering replacement parts.

Our 66, 67 and 68 windows are ordered from Airstream.

They in turn, order them from Atwood, so that they meet the Airstream specs.

VTS is not an Airstream dealer, therefore the only way they can get true Airstream parts, is through a dealer, or pay retail at the factory.

The stainless steel window clips we offer are made locally only for us.

Andy

[Shawnna]

Wow, Thank you for clearing this up for me. I really had no clue. Definitely will consider that when making future purchases.

[Shawnna]

Finally Working on windows today, I have the top frame out and cleaned it up. New glass fits nicely. My question is, do I just place silicone in the frame and then sit the frame with silicone on the new glass... Wait for it to dry and then install the frame and window into the frame work attached to the trailer? Is the silicone all that is needed to hold the window into the frame and how long should I wait for it to dry before attempting to hang it from the trailer? Thank you!

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Shawnna

Finally Working on windows today, I have the top frame out and cleaned it up. New glass fits nicely. My question is, do I just place silicone in the frame and then sit the frame with silicone on the new glass... Wait for it to dry and then install the frame and window into the frame work attached to the trailer? Is the silicone all that is needed to hold the window into the frame and how long should I wait for it to dry before attempting to hang it from the trailer? Thank you!

Silicone is only used when replacing windows on 1966 models.

Add the sealer to the hinge and "immediately" slide the glass into the hinge.

Then close the window and leave it set for about 24 hours.

Lastly, carefully scrape off the silicone that came out of the hinge.

Use a little caution when closing the window. Have someone hold onto it so that it doesn't slide out of the hinge.

Andy

[Shawnna]

Originally Posted by Inland RV Center, In

Silicone is only used when replacing windows on 1966 models.



Add the sealer to the hinge and "immediately" slide the glass into the hinge.



Then close the window and leave it set for about 24 hours.



Lastly, carefully scrape off the silicone that came out of the hinge.



Use a little caution when closing the window. Have someone hold onto it so that it doesn't slide out of the hinge.



Andy

Thank you Andy, I forgot to mention it is a 1967.
Above, you said "Add the sealer" .... Do you mean silicone sealer? Or should I use something else?

[Inland RV Center, In]

Originally Posted by Shawnna

Thank you Andy, I forgot to mention it is a 1967.
Above, you said "Add the sealer" .... Do you mean silicone sealer? Or should I use something else?

NO SILICONE.

On a 67 and 68 you only use double sided sticky tape.

Andy

[BIGED52]

Originally Posted by Shawnna

Thank you Andy, I forgot to mention it is a 1967.
Above, you said "Add the sealer" .... Do you mean silicone sealer? Or should I use something else?

Shawnna, No need for silicone sealant to hold glass into the hinge and glass clamp assembly on your '67 trailer. DO NOT USE ANY SILICONE in this area!

Use a 3M reinforced double sided tape over the entire length of the glass top edge. It should be low enough over both sides of the top edge to be flush with the bottom of the hinge side (outside) and clamp side (inside). Any excess can be trimmed off after the install of the window is completed. Then before you finish the install place a small bead of Acryl-R or Trempro sealant along the bottom edge of both the hinge (outside) and clamp (inside) parts to keep moisture out of the inner gaps between the glass and the aluminum. This will help to keep the adhesive dry and it will hold the glass in place for another 40+ years! It takes two people to install the glass, One to hold the glass into the frame and against the hinge the other to screw the clamp on and secure the glass in place. Install the clips on the bottom of the glass and close window assembly overnight to allow the adhesive on the tape to grip the glass properly. Before you close the window use a light coat of silicone lubricant on the surface of the new gaskets (applied with a clean terry cloth) to prevent it from sticking to the glass. You can clean off any excess the next day from the gasket and glass. This is a maint. issue as well so the lube will help to keep the gasket in good condition as long as it is lube a few times a year.

Then do as Andy R. has stated above. Place silicone clear sealant along the outer edge of the hinge assembly. Work the window assembly up and down and the sealant will work into the gap between the aluminum of the inner and outer hinge. This will (if done correctly) fill that gap up and by moving the window assembly up and down will not allow the silicone to lock the hinge gap. It will take a set and still allow free movement of the hinge. The silicone (once set) will not allow moisture into that gap so it will stop any leaks from the hinge area. This is why you won't need a seal at the top edge of the hinge/clamp assembly. The upper portion of the hinge mounting plate (above the hinge) on the exterior of the trailer still needs to be sealed with Trempro or Acryl-R to keep moisture out where it meets the aluminum of the endcaps and sides of the window frames. This sounds like a lot of detail but it really will work and is worth the time it takes to get the windows to seal out water properly. Hope it helps, Ed

[Shawnna]

Originally Posted by BIGED52

Shawnna, No need for silicone sealant to hold glass into the hinge and glass clamp assembly on your '67 trailer. DO NOT USE ANY SILICONE in this area!

Use a 3M reinforced double sided tape over the entire length of the glass top edge. It should be low enough over both sides of the top edge to be flush with the bottom of the hinge side (outside) and clamp side (inside). Any excess can be trimmed off after the install of the window is completed. Then before you finish the install place a small bead of Acryl-R or Trempro sealant along the bottom edge of both the hinge (outside) and clamp (inside) parts to keep moisture out of the inner gaps between the glass and the aluminum. This will help to keep the adhesive dry and it will hold the glass in place for another 40+ years! It takes two people to install the glass, One to hold the glass into the frame and against the hinge the other to screw the clamp on and secure the glass in place. Install the clips on the bottom of the glass and close window assembly overnight to allow the adhesive on the tape to grip the glass properly. Before you close the window use a light coat of silicone lubricant on the surface of the new gaskets (applied with a clean terry cloth) to prevent it from sticking to the glass. You can clean off any excess the next day from the gasket and glass. This is a maint. issue as well so the lube will help to keep the gasket in good condition as long as it is lube a few times a year.

Then do as Andy R. has stated above. Place silicone clear sealant along the outer edge of the hinge assembly. Work the window assembly up and down and the sealant will work into the gap between the aluminum of the inner and outer hinge. This will (if done correctly) fill that gap up and by moving the window assembly up and down will not allow the silicone to lock the hinge gap. It will take a set and still allow free movement of the hinge. The silicone (once set) will not allow moisture into that gap so it will stop any leaks from the hinge area. This is why you won't need a seal at the top edge of the hinge/clamp assembly. The upper portion of the hinge mounting plate (above the hinge) on the exterior of the trailer still needs to be sealed with Trempro or Acryl-R to keep moisture out where it meets the aluminum of the endcaps and sides of the window frames. This sounds like a lot of detail but it really will work and is worth the time it takes to get the windows to seal out water properly. Hope it helps, Ed

Where do I get the 3M reinforced double sided tape? Does it have a special name?

[BIGED52]

Shawnna, Any hardware store or home store should carry it. If not Google it and you should be able to find it in a suitable width. I found it in 1 inch width and did a slight overlap at the top edge of the glass. Ed

[Shawnna]

Originally Posted by BIGED52

Shawnna, Any hardware store or home store should carry it. If not Google it and you should be able to find it in a suitable width. I found it in 1 inch width and did a slight overlap at the top edge of the glass. Ed

Thanks Ed! I will see what I can find locally!

[Shawnna]

Originally Posted by BIGED52

Shawnna, Any hardware store or home store should carry it. If not Google it and you should be able to find it in a suitable width. I found it in 1 inch width and did a slight overlap at the top edge of the glass. Ed

I Did a web search and was wondering if you have a picture of the packaging? Otherwise, I have a few questions
Is it clear or colored?
Is it foam?
Will Scotch brand work also?

I had no idea that there were SO many options for tape!

[BIGED52]

Originally Posted by Shawnna

I Did a web search and was wondering if you have a picture of the packaging? Otherwise, I have a few questions
Is it clear or colored?
Is it foam?
Will Scotch brand work also?

I had no idea that there were SO many options for tape!

Shawnna, Scotch brand will work. Tape should be clear with reinforcing strands running through it. It is not foam. The packaging from my roll is long gone so no pic available. Try to get it in 2 inch width and if not that wide then overlap the tape on the top edge of the glass. Once installed just trim off any excess at the edges of your clamp and hinge aluminum. They also make glasing tape that will work. You can buy it at any glass shop. It is sticky both sides and is applied the same way and trimmed off just like the double faced tape. Ed

[Shawnna]

I can not find this locally... Can I use a clear sealant or RV/boat sealant/ silicone?

[BIGED52]

Originally Posted by Shawnna

I can not find this locally... Can I use a clear sealant or RV/boat sealant/ silicone?

Shawnna, What do you want to use clear or RV/Boat sealant/silicone to do. If used in the hinge assembly I would use any good clear silicone sealant. Remember to work the window up and down several times as the silicone begins to set =(firm up). This will allow the silicone to stay in place but not cause the hinge to be sealed up to an immovable state. That way you keep moisture from being able to penetrate into the trailer from wind driven rain or while air pressure is applied to wet skin/window area while driving down the roads. This is the only way to IMO keep the hinge/clamp from leaking. Once you have this done and new seals applied to the frame your window leaks will be history! Just be sure to always be on the lookout for water penetration around the window areas. This is the only instance where silicone should be used on your A/S! Were you able to get the double sided reinforced tape? If not let me know. Ed