Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 04-12-2008, 10:34 AM   #1
Liquid Cooled
 
RedSHED's Avatar
 
2014 16' Sport
Columbus , Indiana
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 485
Images: 2
Walkable

Our city hosted Dan Burden from Walkable Communities Inc last week. He did a short audit with our Parks & Rec people, the city engineer, and the "healthy Communities" group of our local hospital, then gave a debrief in the early afternoon followed by a public session in the evening.

Since on occasion I'm involved with our Parks and Rec, I got an invitation to the afternoon debrief, and was interested enough that I requested a kitchen pass of Mrs RedSHED so I could attend the evening session as well.

It was really interesting, and he presented some things that seem counterintuitive at first.
For example, you can flow more cars through a road at 30mph than you can at 40mph. In fact, at 40mph and 10mph average speeds you get the same number of cars through a section of road per hour (because at 40mph you need a lot more space between cars).
Another bit of data... In every case where lanes have widened past 11 feet for a non-freeway road, fatalities increase.
Also, for many roads, you can flow more cars through a 2 lane with an occasional center turn lane than you can a 4 lane. Part of that is that the limitations are at intersections, and stoplights have to be timed to allow people to walk across the intersection. It takes half as long to cross two lanes as it does 4, and only 60% as long to cross 3 as 5 - meaning a greater percentage of green light for the motorist. I pondered this for a while, but thought about it as a queueing theory problem and concluded this was perfectly logical, mathematically.
Phrased in another context, mowing the lawn isn't a big deal, trimming around the bushes actually takes longer. So instead of buying ever bigger lawnmowers, optimize the landscaping for trimming.

The other thing that was striking was some of the data on roundabouts vs conventional intersections. He described one intersection - in Florida I believe - where they had something like 700 accidents & 200 injuries a year - and a fatality every 14 months. They replaced it with a roundabout and the number of collisions and injuries were cut to less than half, and in the eight years since replacement, they've yet to have a fatality. And yes, with the same daily volume.

There were a number of other points - the value of trees, 22 benefits of bike lanes (only two are for cyclists, by the way), economic impacts of boulevards vs typical 4 lane streets, and much more.

I don't normally get too wound up about this sort of thing, but Parks & Rec is hosting a follow up meeting next month, and I'm looking forward to being involved.

After all, our city should be a place, a place where we want to be, where we want to walk around, where we want our kids to be and have a sense of ownership. Cool stuff.
__________________

__________________
RedSHED is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2008, 11:19 AM   #2
2 Rivet Member
 
westernviews's Avatar
 
2013 27' Flying Cloud
Currently Looking...
Livingston , Texas
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 91
Images: 3
I just rented a thought provoking documentary from Netflix, The End of Suburbia. It paints a dire picture of what is going to happen to many people who live in suburbs, where a car is needed to get to work and to shop, when oil supplies become depleted in the not to distant future.
__________________

__________________
Westernviews.us
westernviews is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2008, 11:27 AM   #3
Rivet Master
Commercial Member
 
vinstream's Avatar
 
1962 19' Globetrotter
1963 19' Globetrotter
1961 19' Globetrotter
Wheat Ridge , Colorado
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 624
Images: 2
Very interesting info!
__________________
www.VINSTREAM.com
Wheat Ridge, Colorado
WBCCI # 1962
Instagram #Vinstream
vinstream is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2008, 11:41 AM   #4
Liquid Cooled
 
RedSHED's Avatar
 
2014 16' Sport
Columbus , Indiana
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 485
Images: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by westernviews
I just rented a thought provoking documentary (snip)
I didn't intend to provoke doom; enough prophets of that already. Surely, however, in every suburb a McHouse or two could be razed to make room for a grocer, a barber, a shoestore and a connecting street, threading things together into a better, more livable place.

What I am interested in, and excited about, is thinking about how to take what we have, and not just make it better, but make it good.
__________________
RedSHED is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2008, 07:43 AM   #5
4 Rivet Member
 
1972 25' Tradewind
Madison , Wisconsin
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 396
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedSHED
Our city hosted Dan Burden from Walkable Communities Inc last week. He did a short audit with our Parks & Rec people, the city engineer, and the "healthy Communities" group of our local hospital, then gave a debrief in the early afternoon followed by a public session in the evening.

Since on occasion I'm involved with our Parks and Rec, I got an invitation to the afternoon debrief, and was interested enough that I requested a kitchen pass of Mrs RedSHED so I could attend the evening session as well.

It was really interesting, and he presented some things that seem counterintuitive at first.
For example, you can flow more cars through a road at 30mph than you can at 40mph. In fact, at 40mph and 10mph average speeds you get the same number of cars through a section of road per hour (because at 40mph you need a lot more space between cars).
Another bit of data... In every case where lanes have widened past 11 feet for a non-freeway road, fatalities increase.
Also, for many roads, you can flow more cars through a 2 lane with an occasional center turn lane than you can a 4 lane. Part of that is that the limitations are at intersections, and stoplights have to be timed to allow people to walk across the intersection. It takes half as long to cross two lanes as it does 4, and only 60% as long to cross 3 as 5 - meaning a greater percentage of green light for the motorist. I pondered this for a while, but thought about it as a queueing theory problem and concluded this was perfectly logical, mathematically.
Phrased in another context, mowing the lawn isn't a big deal, trimming around the bushes actually takes longer. So instead of buying ever bigger lawnmowers, optimize the landscaping for trimming.

The other thing that was striking was some of the data on roundabouts vs conventional intersections. He described one intersection - in Florida I believe - where they had something like 700 accidents & 200 injuries a year - and a fatality every 14 months. They replaced it with a roundabout and the number of collisions and injuries were cut to less than half, and in the eight years since replacement, they've yet to have a fatality. And yes, with the same daily volume.

There were a number of other points - the value of trees, 22 benefits of bike lanes (only two are for cyclists, by the way), economic impacts of boulevards vs typical 4 lane streets, and much more.

I don't normally get too wound up about this sort of thing, but Parks & Rec is hosting a follow up meeting next month, and I'm looking forward to being involved.

After all, our city should be a place, a place where we want to be, where we want to walk around, where we want our kids to be and have a sense of ownership. Cool stuff.
Good stuff, it all makes good sense, but I am not so big on the round abouts after watching a snow plow trying to clear one this last winter.
__________________
Smokin Camel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2008, 08:02 AM   #6
Rivet Master
 
centennialman's Avatar

 
2016 20' Flying Cloud
Centennial , Colorado
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 1,284
If oil runs out and folks can't drive to work (long distances) perhaps we will all become stronger smaller communities of beings who are interested in each other......just like the old days.
__________________
Steve "Centennial Man"
centennialman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2008, 09:59 AM   #7
Rivet Master
 
Mikethefixit's Avatar
 
1977 27' Overlander
Trotwood , Ohio
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,153
Send a message via Yahoo to Mikethefixit
Hummm intresting concept Just like being back on the farm where everybody helped everybody and U knew your neighbor.
Roger
__________________
Mikethefixit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-13-2008, 10:35 AM   #8
Liquid Cooled
 
RedSHED's Avatar
 
2014 16' Sport
Columbus , Indiana
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 485
Images: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by centennialman
If oil runs out ...
Again, that wasn't the point of his presentations.

For the city, it's about building a tax base, lowering expenses, and reducing crime and accidents.

For the citizens, its about quality of life, plus all that other stuff.

For example, less than a mile from our house is a triangle roughly 1/2 mile on a side, containing a variety of stores - grocery, pharmacy, restaurants, barber shops, department store, a Starbucks (but that's hardly a surprise, is it), and more - a good plumbing store a couple of banks etc. It is bounded by a US highway on one side, a four lane road and a 5 lane road on the other sides. The stores are set in it as little islands with their own parking areas. The crosswalks, where present, are inadequate. It is, of course, surrounded by neighborhoods - maybe a couple thousand people within a half mile radius, and an office building with several hundred people - all of whom are strongly discouraged from accessing these things on foot or bike. (I do both, but only with extreme caution). What an opportunity this is!
__________________

__________________
RedSHED is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.