possible names for a new club name

[Ken J]

So Brian - you say "lets have a forum rally" - you have folks call the campground and make there reservations, everyone shows up and Roger trips over the camp table.

He calls his lawyer - "who put this rally together" - "well its a forum rally" "whos the forum rally?" Well "Brian posted to the forums that we should all meet at xyz park" "oh so Brian was in charge of putting this rally on?" Bingo

Not too far fetched of a senerio - yes it may be frivolous maybe not - either way it will cost Brian a bunch of money to prove he didn't hold the rally or was not responsible for Rogers broken leg.

As you say our liablility insurance covers you for things you do to other property, or if someone is hurt on your property - it would not, nor would you want it to, cover you for something like this.

The fact that you went on to say "for fun will give it a name" I would think would further someones case that it is a sponsored event put on by someone.

Roger, you say the same thing - your liablity insurance pays for mistakes you make - the WBCCI insurance that we have as a club protects those of us who put on rallies from any lawsuit that someone may bring against us at a rally.

This is the reason why the WBCCI and other organizations carry insurance.

Ken J.

[azflycaster]

Group picture from a 4CU rally earlier this year. Check out the uniforms...

[Mikethefixit]

Well If I fall over a camp table and break my leg it will be my responsibility not the campground. Cause I probably dragged the table there in the first place. That's a problem with today's society.TO MANY AMBULANCE Chasers or people who want someone else to take responsibility for their mistakes. My insurance will cover my leg and I will not sue the campground for something I did. I am going to a Rally next week but I would never think of sueing my friend who helped set up the rally by starting the ball rolling by merely contacting the campground and setting a date and saying "HEY GANG LETS GO CAMPIN" ?? we are gonna be here on this date. Where is it his responsiblilty that clumsy me triped over a table and broke my leg. ??
It ok U all go and do what u need too Without me.

[Ken J]

Roger - I believe you -I really do, but not everyone thinks the way you an I do - as you said - Ambulance chasers and folks who don't want to take responsibility - who would have ever thought spilling a hot coffee on themselves at McDonalds would end up being a mutli million lawsuit because they were not warned the coffee was hot....?? Or the guy who attempts suicide in a NY subway - jumps in, lives and sues the train? There are actually people (other than lawyers) out there who make their living by suing other people.

Oh the insurance company may cover your leg - but they may also go after your friend Brian because they don't want to be out any money....

We do live in a crazy world...

Ken J.

[Nuvite-F]

Originally Posted by Mikethefixit

My insurance will cover my leg and I will not sue the campground for something I did. I am going to a Rally next week but I would never think of sueing my friend

Actually, Roger, that's not how it works. Your insurance will cover your leg and then your insurance company will sue your friend to get their money back. It's called subrogation. If you read the fine print in your insurance policy you will see that The Insured (that's you) agrees to assist your insurance company in recovering any money due them as a result of money paid out for your care.

See the attached scan of a subrogation questionnaire that I received in the mail not too long ago. If you twist your ankle stepping in a gopher hole, they want to know where it was. If it was in your neighbor's yard, they want to know the name of his insurance company. The lawyers got ya comin' and goin'.

[Lothlorian]

People get together and meet to snow ski, water ski, mountain climb or go bicycling as a group.. Think about it. I tell people I am going bicycling this Saturday and ask friends to join me for a bike ride does that make me liable if one person gets run over? When one person asks a bunch of friends to ride Harleys on the weekend and one of the bikers hits a tree are the other bikers liable? When people take their boats to the lake and have a boat party out in a cove is the person with the idea liable if there is an accident. Think about it. I better not ask friends to got out to eat because if my friends trip over a chair and break their neck that would make me liable for organizing a dinner with friends.

When I go camping I book the site for my wife and I. Not for anybody else. I tell them when I am going to be there and if they decide to join us they need to book in advance. Everybody is on their own. I could see if you reserved sites for 20 people and put them under your name. Then it would be a possiblity of you being liable.

When I go to the Okeefenokee swamp with 12 guys every year we all sign and take responsibilty for ourselves. We rent cabins and boats. I have done it for 5 years now. Nobody is worried about a law suit and we do not have a club with an agenda.

I have been getting together with friends in different situations my whole life. My buddy just took a bunch of friends in his RV to go see ZZ Top. There were no forms signed, or waivers.

Brian

[truckasaurus]

VAT Vintage Airstream Travelers

[Ken J]

To answer your question, Brian, is yes you could be liable - however the key word you use is friends - if you start a new club, you really don't know who's going to join.

And then theres the issue of dues - IRS (sorry I'm a CPA) says your income is all money you receive unless specifically excluded by code - so any money you collect is potentially includeable in your income.

Sorry.......

[Frank's Trailer Works]

Originally Posted by Ken J

Airforums = no liability protection - its not a club

Again - not trying to be difficult - but these are the facts.

Ken J.

I have had a business for the past 9 years and just started another. The IRS just wants their cut and that is no big deal.

[Frank's Trailer Works]

Originally Posted by Ken J

So Brian - you say "lets have a forum rally" - you have folks call the campground and make there reservations, everyone shows up and Roger trips over the camp table.

He calls his lawyer - "who put this rally together" - "well its a forum rally" "whos the forum rally?" Well "Brian posted to the forums that we should all meet at xyz park" "oh so Brian was in charge of putting this rally on?" Bingo

Not too far fetched of a senerio - yes it may be frivolous maybe not - either way it will cost Brian a bunch of money to prove he didn't hold the rally or was not responsible for Rogers broken leg.

As you say our liablility insurance covers you for things you do to other property, or if someone is hurt on your property - it would not, nor would you want it to, cover you for something like this.

The fact that you went on to say "for fun will give it a name" I would think would further someones case that it is a sponsored event put on by someone.

Roger, you say the same thing - your liablity insurance pays for mistakes you make - the WBCCI insurance that we have as a club protects those of us who put on rallies from any lawsuit that someone may bring against us at a rally.

This is the reason why the WBCCI and other organizations carry insurance.

Ken J.

IS THE $%#& WBCCI the only people able to get insurance? KEEP YOUR CLUB, no one is asking you to give it up.

[wheel interested]

Originally Posted by truckasaurus

VAT Vintage Airstream Travelers

Rub, Pub and Grub Sub Club

[Frank's Trailer Works]

I am leaning toward AOA airstream owners association. All inclusive to all models and years. If Wally built it, you are in.

[63air]

The WBCCI wasn't for us but TIN CAN TOURISTS has worked out great. Between TCT, Airstream Life , and the Forum I'm a happy camper. I'm even going to issue myself the number 1963 for my Globtrotter , I just can't decide between blue or green. That should get a reaction out of the triple axle, Suburban crowd as I pass by them on the road.

[47WeeWind]

Originally Posted by Mikethefixit

. . . My insurance will cover my leg and I will not sue the campground for something I did.

Roger: You are correct that once you accept payment from your insurance company, you will not sue the campground. You will not be able to sue the campground because, in exchange for receiving payment from your insurance company, you will assign to it all your rights to recover against anyone at fault for causing your injury. So your insurance company may very well sue the campground, and perhaps also sue your friend who invited you there and organized the "unsafe" event at which you got injured. Ask your insurance agent about subrogation and assignment of rights.

[drag'nwagon]

Originally Posted by 47WeeWind

Roger: You are correct that once you accept payment from your insurance company, you will not sue the campground. You will not be able to sue the campground because, in exchange for receiving payment from your insurance company, you will assign to it all your rights to recover against anyone at fault for causing your injury. So your insurance company may very well sue the campground, and perhaps also sue your friend who invited you there and organized the "unsafe" event at which you got injured. Ask your insurance agent about subrogation and assignment of rights.

Well, perhaps that's it then. I will have to stop camping with friends and organizing, and participating in voluntary free rallies, through a free forum with free Americans.

[PeeWee]

Without anger there is probably no emotion at all. Demeaning seems to be the safety valve for everything.

[whitsend]

Originally Posted by utee94

Anyway, how 'bout Vintage Trailerites Association?

Marcus - I'm lucky enough to own both ~ a "modern" 2003 Classic and a vintage 1954 Cruiser. If you call the new club "Vintage Trailerites Assn.", will those who don't have the pleasure of owning a vintage be allowed to join in the fun??

From what I've read here, could it be possible the Airstream Co. just might accomodate a new club using the trademarked Airstream name . . . ? As in Airstream Owners Assn.

[byamcaravanner]

Originally Posted by 65GT

That liability insurance continues to gain us access to exclusive sites where nobody else camps -- ever...

Leo, thanks for all the great info. I'm curious, since you are "up" on the budget, what does this Liability Insurance cost the club?

[mutcth]

Originally Posted by 62overlander

I am leaning toward AOA airstream owners association. All inclusive to all models and years. If Wally built it, you are in.

I guess you mean if Wally, Art, Beatrice, or Thor built it....

Tom, pining for an Argosy Minuet

[Nuvite-F]

Originally Posted by 65GT

I can't be certain, without getting confirmation, but it looks like it's about $40,000.00 a year...

Which, in perspective, is about $6 - 7 a year per member family.