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Old 05-06-2009, 07:52 AM   #15
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Old 05-06-2009, 08:11 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Wayne&Sam View Post
I friend of mine bought a used 1996 Toyota pickup several years ago and he still has it. This wasn't for towing, just a daily drive. It turns out Toyota pickups had frame problems from something like 1996- 2001, so they just recalled it. They paid him 1.5 times the highest Blue Book value plus $1,000 off a new truck. So he got his fully purchase price back and $1,000! That is doing right by your customers.
Yes, one of the Dad's from my Scout troop got caught short in this (unanounced?) recall. Brought his truck to the yota dealer for an oil change, they put it up on the lift, called him, and told him the frame was so corroded they could not let him drive the truck.
He did not make out so well, as he left there with a Corrola (?) or some kind of small car...
He is not pleased.

A Hino (never heard of them) AFAIK cannot handle my 3000# TC. Nor can any other foreign made vehicle for sale in the US.

I have no doubt my DuraMax/Allison will be around for at least as many years as my last GM truck.
If GM is not around when I need to replace it, I will buy a Ford. I have owned one before and it was a great truck. 215k miles and was still around for a while after I sold it...
Ford's have great payload capacity and some nice features on the new ones.
But it is unlikely Chevy trucks will be going anywhere except up from here.This economy has been brutal to all manufacturers. GM has taken some significant LOANS from Uncle Sam...it will be a challenge to pay it back. Too bad banks were not held to the same standard.

BTW; even yota is way off for the year...37% last I heard.VW is slated to take over as the #1 global automotive sales volume leader. VW is big in Europe, as they don't care for japanese vehicles either...they are much too nationalistic. We could learn from them.

Bill
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Old 05-06-2009, 08:34 PM   #17
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Not the prettiest looking vehicle but here you go

Hino Motors Canada, Ltd. - 2010 Hino 358 Class 7

I'm not sure about Europeans not liking Japanese vehicles, granted we British did favor British cars until most of the British manufacturers were wiped out with the 70's union "struggles" coupled with terrible reliability problems. I could be wrong but I believe the biggest UK domestic manufacturer is the London Taxi company, that's all that's left.
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Old 05-06-2009, 08:52 PM   #18
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Well, Bill, Hino is Toyota's truck division. By trucks, I mean commercial trucks. If you want "street cred," Hino has won the under 10,000cc division of the Paris to Dakar rally for 17 straight years. When the diesel Tundra hits the market, I'm guessing it will have a Hino motor. You've probably seen Hino trucks around Texas (often configured as box trucks) and just didn't notice them.

The smallest Hino (the 145) compares roughly to the Ford F-350. Heck, Nissan and Isuzu are players in what you might call the "medium duty" market... not for consumer trucks, but for commercial fleet vehicles. These are not "pickups" but trucks which can be built as flatbeds, dump trucks, tow trucks, box trucks, etc. The success of the Tundra is due in no small part to the Hino experience. My guess is that if American automakers continue to struggle, Toyota will move into the consumer 3/4 to 1 ton market with either an upsized Tundra or a downsized Hino. But make no mistake, Bill, there are "foreign trucks" that will tow your whole shooting match down the road.
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Old 05-06-2009, 09:12 PM   #19
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Well, Bill, Hino is Toyota's truck division. By trucks, I mean commercial trucks. If you want "street cred," Hino has won the under 10,000cc division of the Paris to Dakar rally for 17 straight years. When the diesel Tundra hits the market, I'm guessing it will have a Hino motor. You've probably seen Hino trucks around Texas (often configured as box trucks) and just didn't notice them.

The smallest Hino (the 145) compares roughly to the Ford F-350. Heck, Nissan and Isuzu are players in what you might call the "medium duty" market... not for consumer trucks, but for commercial fleet vehicles. These are not "pickups" but trucks which can be built as flatbeds, dump trucks, tow trucks, box trucks, etc. The success of the Tundra is due in no small part to the Hino experience. My guess is that if American automakers continue to struggle, Toyota will move into the consumer 3/4 to 1 ton market with either an upsized Tundra or a downsized Hino. But make no mistake, Bill, there are "foreign trucks" that will tow your whole shooting match down the road.
Towing not so much my concern as hauling (payload). And I need a pickup, not a commercial body.I don't want a hiny, a yukozota, or a shitzujunki. I want an American made, American designed, American built, by an American owned, listed on an American stock exchange company, freakin' truck.
I do not want UAW workers to make less than they do now.I don't care what other companies pay their workers. Foreign companies subsidize health care, pay lower wages, and do not have the same tarrifs as US Companies. They do not compete on a level field. Why would anyone want a US industry to suffer. What do you do for a living? Should we suggest your salary should be on a level with foreigners?
( I have never been a union employee, have never worked for a union company. I am white collar. Born on the 4th of July. American). I do not want the American way of life compromised. At any level.
It is beyond me why any American would celebrate the demise of American manufacturing.
Let alone contribute to it.
As noted, the Brits have seen all of their automotive manufactures disintegrate. I believe the largest sellers there now are VW and Opel
(GM) which is also on the block. I am pretty darn sure they are not happy about this.

Tomorrow will be a good day; I return this piece of crap rental car I have been driving all week! Sorry, but I could never own one of these things...they are horrible.
Gene, at least I gave it a try!

Bill
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Old 05-06-2009, 11:31 PM   #20
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Prius as Toyota's flagship, not by a huge margin. Try the Lexus LS 09, 380 horsepower. Now that's a flagship! I guess for Ford owners a Prius looks like a flagship. Just think of the Prius as Toyota's equivalent to the Ford Focus but with intelligent design, decent gas mileage,reliability, and durability. One can't even hope for those attributes when thinking of the Focus!

I'm happy to give the American manufacturers the same consideration they've given me for the past 30 years. They know how to treat the people who buy what their products and I know how to treat them. Sufice to say it's not a love - love relationship, more like distain! I'll continue to go with a company that respects me as a buyer.
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Old 05-07-2009, 07:42 AM   #21
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It's been very easy for Toyota/Honda dealers to bend over backwards in the customer service area as the manufacturing companies they represent have government involvement. Too, there are a third fewer dealerships, thus far more profitable than domestic dealers. The vast majority of Tundra sales are coming from loyal Toyota owners. From my observations, these people would rather eat worms than set foot in a Ford /Dodge/Chevy dealership.

It will be interesting to see how our domestic automotive industry will fare with government involvement. I predict that down the road, a super clean low mileage F-250 or GMC 2500 diesel could return 100% on the original investment as our "domestic" manufacturers will be forced to build cars or trucks that lack any towing capacity.

Anybody out there remember the LeCar? That was an Anglo-French preview of what we have to look forward to in the government forced Chrysler/Fiat partnership.
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Old 05-07-2009, 10:38 AM   #22
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Between serving in the U.S. military ten years (active and reserve) and paying a fair amount of taxes, I figure my citizenship dues are paid in full. One of the great things about America is that you need money, but no real reason, to buy or not buy anything your heart desires. You can buy an American vehicle because it makes you feel patriotic, because the color matches your eyes perfectly or because you are an Aries who just feels right in a Dodge Ram. By the way, I have a 2009 Dodge Ram rental because my Nissan Titan is in the shop (accident, not my fault). I like the Titan better.

I'm not going to tell other people how to spend their money. As far as I'm concerned, if you earned it, how you spend it is your business. I feel the same way about how I spend my money. My wife and I donate a fair amount of money to charity. I don't think General Motors is a charity. When it comes to business, I'm a firm believer in the free enterprise system. Successful business should earn profits. Unsuccessful businesses should fail. I don't think government should be in the business of picking winners and losers in the marketplace. That's a job for customers.

Personally, I think of many large companies as effectively transnational. Toyota builds vehicles in America using American parts and American labor. Americans own shares in Toyota; foreign citizens own shares of American firms. In the midst of this global economy, I just want to own the most reliable, cost-effective vehicle that meets my needs. The company that builds that vehicle gets my money.

America economic strength is not in having the government prop up failed businesses or protect American firms with tariffs. The greater extent to which we allow the free market system to work, the greater our economic power and affluence... whether we build cars here or not.
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Old 05-07-2009, 03:48 PM   #23
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Bill, it appears you didn't give the Prius a try; your mind was made up before you ever got in it. Nice thing, no one forces you or me to buy any brand. We all make up our own minds.

In recent years Toyota has been establishing a market in Europe, a continent they had largely ignored for years. Sales there went up fast, so Europeans like them too.

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Old 05-07-2009, 04:00 PM   #24
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CrawfordGene said,
"your mind was made up before you ever got in it".

I think that that is the attitude of a lot of Toyota/Honda buyers. How's that for taking something totally out of context?
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Old 05-07-2009, 04:18 PM   #25
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I didn't buy a Toyota until 1999. I thought the cabs of their pickups were uncomfortable and poorly designed. Since then, they are much better. I know US trucks have improved (would they have if they didn't have competition from Toyota and others?), but the Toyota's have worked out so well for us we see now reason to change.

I bought a '73 Honda Civic and it was a throw away car. I understand they got better after that, but I guess my mind is made up. I have owned several American vehicles—they were mostly really bad vehicles. I've had some bad foreign vehicles too, but the record has been that overall the foreign ones have been much better that the US ones. That is sad, but I'm not buying vehicles with bad reputations and bad reviews.

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Old 05-07-2009, 06:59 PM   #26
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"I want an American made, American designed, American built, by an American owned, listed on an American stock exchange company, freakin' truck."

Name one. My F250 was built in Canada, my Tundra was built in USA according to the VINs.
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Old 05-07-2009, 08:42 PM   #27
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I had a '77 Honda Civic for a very brief time. It was orange and had issues. The '73 Toyota Celica was a far better car. The worst non-pickup I owned was a '74 Ford LTD. The best was '76 Volvo. One of the most fun to drive was a Mazda RX-7 from the early 80s. It left with a particular female acquaintance... every so often, I still miss the car.

I have driven pickups of every vintage from the 50s to today. Overall, I think 1/2 or 3/4 ton pickups are much nicer now... and I'm not just saying that because of the sound systems and satellite radio. I think one of the main reasons American vehicles have improved as much as they have is foreign competition. Choice is good.
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Old 05-07-2009, 09:28 PM   #28
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Love my Prius

I've put about 20000 miles on our 2008 Prius in the past year and I love it, especially the regenerative braking. I was driving an 18 year old Honda Accord with 240000 miles on it, but my job location changed and with the longer commute I wanted something more reliable and fuel efficient. I drive it every day and have taken a couple of 800 mile weekend trips and I'm happy with it for long drives too - even put the back seats down and slept in the back once. With 4 kids we do a lot of dropping off and picking up, and it's great for that. We just can't use it when we take the whole family somewhere.
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