How will an economic collapse affect the RV/TT lifestyle?

[jimmini]

I say NO bailout or help to Wall Street from the government.
Can you see a bunch of bureaucrats dolling out the $$$$$$$$$$
SURE YOU CAN TRUST THE GOVERNMENT.ASK ANY INDIAN.

[Jim & Susan]

Thought y'all might get a kick outta this. I wrote to our Congressman several days ago expressing my thoughts about the the current "crises". When I tried to answer his response to my response last night I got this (today also). Our tax dollars at work, eh? I guess the good news is that folks have finally figured out that they can make a difference one way or another. I suggest that we all chastise "them" for allowing their (or is it our?) website to crash at such a critical time in our history. Hope the attached pic works.

Jim

[Blevi]

I got the same thing Jim. You and I must have been trying at the same time. The government computers likely couldn't handle two at once.

[craftsman]

Originally Posted by willyd

Look forward - look up to the creator.

I've seen bumper stickers that declare "God Saves" but if he (she) knew anything about finances, we wouldn't be in this mess.

[Silvertwinkie]

I was beside myself when I watched friends and family ride this credit wave these past 9-10 years. We didn't. To give you an example, my current daily driver is 12 years old...it's predecessor was a 25 year old car. I was amazed and somewhat concerned when my house values skyrocketed nearly 3x to what it was worth nearly 10 years ago. The inflation of the home prices made it difficult to move up to a bit larger house because I wasn't willing to pay some of these inflated prices for a home around here and the subsequent taxes based on those war buck dollar values. Could I have done it? Sure, I could have very, very, very easily gotten a loan (as many did), but running the numbers it just didn't make sense to me. Many folks who did jump on the bandwagon around here tapped off some of those inflated values out of the houses like an ATM for trips, expensive cars, etc. Like the tech bubble, one knew this ride wasn't going to last forever, few rides do...and of course now hindsight being 20/20 you can see in the weekly paper 2-3 pages of foreclosures (up from maybe just 2 or 3 listings 3-5 years ago) and know exactly how most of these folks got to this point.

Bail out the banks and the folks that used their homes as ATMs and/or lived beyond their means? It takes two to tango and I would hold both the banks and the individuals who over extended themselves in contempt as these folks represent one of the major reasons why we are now in this mess. Sure there were other contributing factors, but if you live beyond your means and you have creditors willing to keep you going, even though your income doesn't support it, I'm sorry, but I can see no reason why anyone should pony up neary (or maybe even over) a trillion dollars.

Perhaps this crunch will severely put a dent in the economy and that this will in fact force us all to quit abusing credit cold turkey.

A bit of Darwinisim might be just what the doctor ordered.

[Aage]

I think it's a very dangerous precedent to bail out the very institutions that are supposed to safeguard our money and our monetary system.

You think this is a one-time deal? Don't believe that for a minute!

Every time the going gets rough, who do you think they will turn to in the future?

[purman]

Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie

I was beside myself when I watched friends and family ride this credit wave these past 9-10 years. We didn't. To give you an example, my current daily driver is 12 years old...it's predecessor was a 25 year old car. I was amazed and somewhat concerned when my house values skyrocketed nearly 3x to what it was worth nearly 10 years ago. The inflation of the home prices made it difficult to move up to a bit larger house because I wasn't willing to pay some of these inflated prices for a home around here and the subsequent taxes based on those war buck dollar values. Could I have done it? Sure, I could have very, very, very easily gotten a loan (as many did), but running the numbers it just didn't make sense to me. Many folks who did jump on the bandwagon around here tapped off some of those inflated values out of the houses like an ATM for trips, expensive cars, etc. Like the tech bubble, one knew this ride wasn't going to last forever, few rides do...and of course now hindsight being 20/20 you can see in the weekly paper 2-3 pages of foreclosures (up from maybe just 2 or 3 listings 3-5 years ago) and know exactly how most of these folks got to this point.

Bail out the banks and the folks that used their homes as ATMs and/or lived beyond their means? It takes two to tango and I would hold both the banks and the individuals who over extended themselves in contempt as these folks represent one of the major reasons why we are now in this mess. Sure there were other contributing factors, but if you live beyond your means and you have creditors willing to keep you going, even though your income doesn't support it, I'm sorry, but I can see no reason why anyone should pony up neary (or maybe even over) a trillion dollars.

Perhaps this crunch will severely put a dent in the economy and that this will in fact force us all to quit abusing credit cold turkey.

A bit of Darwinisim might be just what the doctor ordered.

A-Men... Right on the money.... thats what I have been saying too... Brought on by our greed to have every toy and a big house... Where I live everyone has an ATV $5000 for a used one sometimes... they will finance you no problem.. We have 10 acres and I guess I could use one but walking is no big deal for me....

Pay Cash it's a sure way to keep you in line... Somethings You can't always , but you should with toys...

[warbler5]

We have a friend who works for a car dealership. He says that, even people with excellent credit, may not be able to finance a vehicle 100% anymore with some banks....especially trucks and SUV's. I say.....it's about time! If you can afford the payments, then put some cash down.

When I was growing up, my parents paid cash for everything except their house. We have tried to do the same, and we now live debt-free in our retirement. If we DO finance a vehicle, we pay it off as soon as we can! We have tried to teach our kids to do the same, but time will only tell how they live their lives. I think that watching this fiasco unfold will certainly teach them something....

[Poprivet]

This whole economic thing really sucks - Tell you one thing, gonna be lots of veggy gardens, chickens, pigs.

I mean juicy red tomatoes, eggs with yokes so yellow they look orange, and rhubarb growing wild. Hmm, ever see a David Bradley Tiller? Ever milk a goat?

We just might find that families have purpose - Children have chores - Grandparents have responsibilities.

Our farmers have suffered for years, but you know what? you can live on 25 acres of fertile land if you have water.

[Silvertwinkie]

Ok, now that the Senate appears to be passing this travesty here is what I believe will effect me and my RVing lifestyle due to IMHO the almost certain devaluation of the dollar, since many things are tied to the US Dollar.

1) Energy prices, namely gasoline, diesel and let's not forget the others will spike. This will translate to even higher energy prices overall making driving and/or RVing for the average person a steep price...and if you think RVing is expensive, looked for an airline ticket lately? Just looked for a puddle jumper flight from Milwaukee to Iron Mountain. Three years ago, that ticket one way was under $100. Know what it is today? $800 minimum, one way!

2) Food. Nearly everything is hauled by train and truck. These run on diesel. Diesel IMHO as well as gasoline is going to spike, making transport costs increase which will effect not only your grocery bill, but nearly every shopping endeavor you do on a monthly basis, and I'm not simply talking out of the norm shopping, I'm talking the monthly stuff, tissues, TP, paper towels, laundry detergent. These extra costs will impact fuel spending which will effect travel for a fair number of folks.

3) Higher prices may force some folks to cut back, causing more pain for companies, which in turn may lay off folks. Unemployed folks can hardly afford to be running around the country at $4.00 or possibly as high as $6/gallon or even more. Think that can't happen? Look at what Europeans pay for fuel.

4) Higher prices outpacing any meager cost of living increases in salary may have folks shifting to credit cards, if any of us are still lucky to have one that works. . Putting overages on credit will lead to folks carrying balances, which in part is how we got in this pickle (spending more than we take in), making it again difficult to go RVing when some may be having a hard time paying for the increases they will most likely see as a result of the government stepping in to bail out banks and devaluing the dollar, which brings me to point 5....

5) Banks who are bailed out because of their own greed will not be forced in any bills I've read to lend money. For banks that do lend, I can promise you, you'll sign over your first, second and third born to get that credit, which will no doubt make borrowing somewhat more difficult than it was before, which will also have an impact on many folks hauling their RVs around with 10 to 15mpg.

Bottom line, and I mean no disrespect to those hurting, but if we have to spend nearly or more than a trillion dollars to save banks, I say let the banks die and let the laws of Capitalism take effect. The weak disappear or are absorbed, we go through a really rough patch, and the government stops this nonsense of blindly throwing large sums of money a the problem. IMHO we are using ICBMs when a more surgical strike is what is required. We can't even fund Social Security, healthcare, etc, yet we have nearly a trillion dollars to bail out banks? This is not like bailing out Chrysler in the 80s or lending the big 3 25 billion to get their heads out of their behinds, this is some very serious money we're talking here...and the thought that we're gonna buy all this bad paper and be able to recoup any real portion of it, guess again....and anyone taking comfort in the government having a significant stake in any private company gives me hives. First the gov eavesdrops on citizens without any warrants, the gov has significant stakes in some of the largest banks out there. Folks, look at history, see any parallels?

Sorry for the rant, but the bill just passed the Senate and if it passes the house later on, I think we're going to be in far more trouble than we might have been otherwise. I pray that I am way, way off here, but me thinks this is only the tip of the iceberg we're seeing, the Titanic is still gonna take on water no matter what is or isn't done and all the money that can be thrown at it, just as the real ship on that fateful day, won't stop it from sinking.

[ROBERT CROSS]

"The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter"

"The inherit vise of Capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings,
The inherit vice of Socialism is the equal sharing of miseries".........W. Churchill

[Poprivet]

Hey - I don't understand all this stuff but I think, no, I know that solor panels can provide an Airstreams energy needs

[Over59]

Boys and girls it's not over until it's over. Anyway you look at it there will be pain. But the dollar will go up against the Euro because they will have an even worse time and more trouble agreeing what to do, diesel and gas will come down, the deals on all kind of stuff will be stunning, and your friends will lose their jobs, your house will be worth 2000 prices. Get a mattress and a good lock.

[Poprivet]

I'm on my way to the balloon fiesta and have travelled from Florida to New Mexico. My cheapest gas was $3.17.

I'm just saying that it might be nice to have a return to basic life. Values of work - physical work - It just might solve some of our social problems. want a divorce? sorry, someone gotta collect the eggs.

Okey - okey, and cook them

[Silvertwinkie]

Originally Posted by Over59

Boys and girls it's not over until it's over. Anyway you look at it there will be pain. But the dollar will go up against the Euro because they will have an even worse time and more trouble agreeing what to do, diesel and gas will come down, the deals on all kind of stuff will be stunning, and your friends will lose their jobs, your house will be worth 2000 prices. Get a mattress and a good lock.

Though I don't disagree, part of the undercurrent to my comments are that our elected officials (both sides of the aisle) aren't even sure if this will fully work, if at all. A pretty big gamble IMHO, but I got me a mattress and a good lock....got my house in 1997, so maybe I may be able to eek out 3 years of appreciation (maybe not if you take into account this bailout is equal to about $6800 for every household, even the ones that didn't have any part in this mess) , if there is anyone out there who could get a loan for it....but I'm keeping the mattress and the lock though.

[16595]

Agree with much of what is said here. As usual, much wisdom in this community.

If I may take the liberty of inserting an email I received today, we have a partial explanation of why the congress' website is not functioning. Although many folks didn't need this to get their juices flowing, this is food for thought. This is a Dave Ramsey publication:

++++++
We are at a crucial time in our country's financial history. Congress defeated the $700 billion bailout plan on Monday. However, they are revising it and trying to push it through again. I'm supporting an alternative plan that will keep our nation from going even deeper in debt, and I've been on TV and radio all week telling people about it.
We need everyone's help!

Follow the instructions below. Together we can change history.

Pray for them to resist a spirit of FEAR and to embrace WISDOM. Even if you don't like them or agree with them, pray for them and tell them you are praying for them. There is a spirit over this problem that must be broken. Also, most of the media personalities are afraid as well and that is affecting their reporting. Pray for fear to be removed from them; they are making this worse.</SPAN></SPAN>


Send The Common Sense Fix to your Representatives and Senators and tell them how you expect them to vote, and that if they put this nation in $700 billion of debt, that you will vote them out. It's their job to listen to us! (Whichever presidential candidate or political party that champions this plan from their leadership down will likely become the next president. That is because this plan fixes the crisis while going along with the wishes of the vast majority of Americans.)

1. First, read this page (PDF)
2. Next, copy the info on this page (text file)
3. Send it to your Senators and representatives by copying and pasting the text in the web form you're sent to.

*Note: If their websites are down, that means we're making a difference! Keep refreshing the page until you get through. You can also go through Congress.org, though we don't endorse this site.

Forward this email to everyone in your address book and tell them to urgently follow these 3 steps TODAY. The more people we have supporting this and contacting their elected leaders, the more likely we can turn our economy around!

++++++++++++

I got through to our Senators, but have not succeeded in sending to the Reps.

Dwight

[vox]

My towing days are over. My Overlander is parked permanently at our cottage which is on a small Gulf Island. Between the fuel for my van with a big V8 and the enormous rise in ferry fares we just dont travel the way we used to. I restored an Itaska Phasar last year( aluminum body aft of the drivers area and an efficient turbo diesel that give 35mpg to a cdn gal) It's just 20 ft and the airconditioner was removed for a low profile Maxxair in pairs so we are not over height. Now we get on the ferry for the price of a car and save 120.00 a trip, not to mention fuel.

So now my restoration project will change somewhat as I will not have any considerations re hauling, weight and balance or water and waste tanks.

This may horrify some members but it is what works for me. I'll just have to live on memories of when propane was 6.9 cents a litre and I never thought twice about driving about in that big V8

[richie rich]

traditionally election years are busy.lots of money flying around,but the bucks have almost stopped completely.i'm in concrete construction and this week i put in a total of 8 hours.just about enough to pay insurance and gas.between now and the end of january finding time to camp in the airstream may not be a problem.i'm going to go with the flow and think realisticly.now is the time for my hobbies,my pasttimes.being the dinasour i am ,what i see today is reminicent of the '70's.good jobs were scarce money was tight,crime and substance abuse were high.come to think of it,i was high too!

[Lothlorian]

I have been watching people borrow and spend past their means for years. Even with the economy the way it is I have friends talking about the deals out there to be had and spending money they don't have. I still do not think the baby boomer generation gets it. It was a matter of time before it would all come crashing down. People are addicted to spending much like a drug addict is hooked on drugs. They are not happy unless they are buying something.

Times will get hard and changes will be made in all the different areas of life. The jobs exported to other countries may comeback because when our economy goes bust so does theirs. The positive I heard out of the negative was the only car sales that were doing half way decent were the hybrid cars. Maybe it will take a crash for us as a nation to start to conserve our resources, develop renewable energy technologies, and restructure our daily lives so we are spending more time with our families and staying close to home. Vacations they will be camping with the family giving each kid a camp chore and making it fun for everybody.

This may have been already posted because this thread is very long but many you heard of Hooverville during the depression. Well what about Airstreamville. If the worst happens we can all pull our airstreams to a central location and make a community.

I like the thread above about growing vegetables and raising chickens. I live in a metro suburban neighborhood and guess what? We have a neighbor raising chickens and rabbits, another one a street over built a sheep pen in the back and is breeding sheep. This is a middle class neighborhood. "Man who lives the longest lives closest to the ground"

Lothlorian

Brian

[Aage]

Originally Posted by Lothlorian

I like the thread above about growing vegetables and raising chickens. I live in a metro suburban neighborhood and guess what? We have a neighbor raising chickens and rabbits, another one a street over built a sheep pen in the back and is breeding sheep. This is a middle class neighborhood. "Man who lives the longest lives closest to the ground"

Lothlorian

Brian

Kids, don't you all try that at home though, or daddy will wind up with some serious Trouble with the City! Well at least around here you will...