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Old 11-29-2015, 09:02 AM   #85
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Well, that would not be fair at all and would diminish the stature of those chosen to lord over all of us regular people!


Brevi tempore!
Yes, I realize now that I was being unfair and harmful to our esteemed leaders massive egos. I retract my proposal and submit a new first 2 step list.

1: Ban all private conveyances for anyone who is NOT a politician

2: Let those who are NOT politicians revert to a life of the 1800s.
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Old 11-29-2015, 09:21 AM   #86
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By and large what's now called man made climate change used to be called air pollution. Maybe some of you recall the terrible smog in the major cities back in the 1960s and 70s. The sky's were brown and breathing was difficult. That's mostly cleared up now after smart scientist and engineers discovered the cause and found effective solutions, namely pollution controls for vehicles and use of superior computation technology such as fuel injection.

Remember the ozone layer? A complete loss would have been very serious. Life on earth would have been vastly less diverse. Again smart scientists figured out the culprit, a simple unintended chemical reaction between high altitude ozone and a man made chemical compound. Worldwide leadership worked together to make changes that changed course to a solution.

Both times plenty of naysayers but facts are facts, and today nobody is complaining too loudly about still being alive.

Not saying everybody should discard their Airstream and vehicles and move to a urban condo above a transit center with three roommates and share a bicycle and become a vegetarian. But think about it. This is where some policy makers are headed, and they intend to force this change by making fossil fuels very expensive.

What lifestyle do you wish for your children and grandchildren. For my part I use solar, not a generator for power. I tow at 55 to 60 to minimize fuel burn, and don't move the trailer too often, instead use it as a home base. I also mostly cut out meat, but mostly for health reasons.
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Old 11-29-2015, 09:31 AM   #87
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Global Geological Climate Change... Conference

Say they were right about the ozone layer.

At the heart of the destruction of the ozone layer was the notion that trace fluorocarbons were capable of destroying trace ozone via catalytic process where one fluorocarbon molecule was capable of destroying perhaps 10,000 ozone atoms.

I could look at the argument proposed and know that if this catalytic process was factual, I could look at the argument and see that it made sense.

AGW has no like foundation of hard science.

The cleaning of car exhaust into the early 90s got car emissions 98% clean compared to the1960s, the lengths we have gone since are extraneous in my opinion.

There is a point of diminishing returns with regard to cost/benefit.


Brevi tempore!
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Old 11-29-2015, 09:42 AM   #88
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In the case of ozone destruction, an argument with a base of catalytic destruction of ozone was a point of origin from which the argument was based, no such foundation was lain for AGW, just an unproven assertion of the power of trace CO2 to drive temperature.


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Old 11-29-2015, 09:43 AM   #89
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I propose steps 1 and 2 to begin the reversal of climate change.

1: Ban all private jets and other type of private aircraft used by politicians.

2: Ban all limousines and other private conveyances used by politicians.

Let them all use public transportation to attend these conferences.
Of course one would need to ban second houses, more than a couple pairs of shoes, thermostats that can be turned up over 68 degrees, fishing boats, snomobiles, pro sports games and stadiums, Airstreams, toys, makeup, sexy clothing, more than a 2000 calorie/day intake, personal transportation televisions, lawn mowers, and a huge list of other things that are unnecessary for general survival.
Right?
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Old 11-29-2015, 09:46 AM   #90
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Yes, but you forgot to number them.
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Old 11-29-2015, 09:55 AM   #91
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Actually, in order to save the earth, we must eliminate all metabolic process, all oxidation, and all photosynthesis. As rocks and minerals are the "first owners" of planet earth, we need to do our part to restore the earth to its prior state before living plants, creatures, and microbes ruined it.

It is going to be a big project, but I am sure the goal can be accomplished if we work together as if we are of one mind.


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Old 11-29-2015, 09:57 AM   #92
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Actually, in order to save the earth, we must eliminate all metabolic process, all oxidation, and all photosynthesis. As rocks and minerals are the "first owners" of planet earth, we need to do our part to restore the earth to its prior state before living plants, creatures, and microbes ruined it.

It is going to be a big project, but I am sure the goal can be accomplished if we work together as if we are of one mind.


Brevi tempore!

Now we're talking.
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Old 11-29-2015, 10:03 AM   #93
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The same type of technology that cleaned up car emissions has been used to clean coal fired plants. Yet even though they can be clean, the climate change people still want them eliminated. That's where the politics comes on. Auto standards embraced ten years ago as being all we need are now being touted as not good enough. In the seventys we were told the cuyahoga river was burning and would never be clean, Lake Erie would never support fish again and we would all be long since dead by the end of the century. Mother Nature has a way of cleansing herself with a little bit of help from us. The standards set to clean up the lake worked, so why do we continually see stiffer standards.? Why? Because it isn't enough to stop polution, you must punish those respnsible even if they were operating under the govt regs set at that time. That's how the climate change people think. We can use coal safely now but because the coal industry must be punished none of us can benefit from it. But it's okay to ship it from Canada to other countries along with oil. Bring the US back to pre industrial revolution days while the rest if the world profits because of our political leaders decisions all in the name of climate change.
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Old 11-29-2015, 10:15 AM   #94
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Ban people. That's the problem.
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Old 11-29-2015, 10:15 AM   #95
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Global Geological Climate Change... Conference

Oh come on!

Politicians would never hijack and nurture a "grass roots" movement to make money and solidify their power and control by tugging at their subordinates heartstrings.

That is just silly talk. I am not going to just sit here while people run down our fine upstanding and loyal politicians.

They love us and only want what is best for us. If we reject their teachings and edicts, well, we will have to suffer their wrath.

On behalf of the collective,
Brevi tempore!
Over and out!
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Old 11-29-2015, 10:38 AM   #96
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Oh, yea!
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Old 11-29-2015, 12:08 PM   #97
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Because your links are all connected to the flawed studies by the same interconnected groups that have a political agenda. Almost all the studies are done by the UN or other political agency's. The scientists must come up with the prearranged conclusions or have there funding cut off. This is a fact. Follow the politics from the universities on up to the federally govt and the UN. Lockstep. Studies done by nongovernmental connected organizations are generally ignored out of hand. Why? Someone doesntvwant the pot stirred or the truth to come out. Yes, oil companies have a vested interest in climate change studies, financially. But govt funded studies have a politically vested interest, world domination through legislation based on false assumptions. And the polis are winning!!
If the only tool available is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

If one has already decided that everything is a government plot, then everything will look like it was created by those with an agenda, whether that be anthropogenic climate change or whatever.

Look to the science. If you like, look to the studies funded by the oil companies. Those studies came to clear conclusions. And then some oil companies decided it was in their business interests to create doubt, and so stopped funding research, and started funded groups designed solely to create that doubt, and thus extend the period in which they could apply their then current business model. Don't fall for it.
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Old 11-29-2015, 12:23 PM   #98
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Yea, because historically evil corporations are the parties that have caused the most harm in this world, certainly not politicians.

Corporations really wont pay "carbon taxes", it will be consumers and producers that finance the political cut of energy markets.

The taxes wont change the behavior of the rich and powerful, but it will place a heavy burden on the working poor of the world.




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