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Old 09-04-2005, 09:14 AM   #449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverhawk
It is no wonder to me that this thread keeps riseing to the top of the forum list.
There is so much hot air being expressed here, I have to put on my gas mask just to open it up.

But you just couldnt resist...huh?

Its kinda like voting...if you didnt participate...then put a sock in it.
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Old 09-04-2005, 09:55 AM   #450
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck
here is an *actual* fact:
Kerry got 62% of the vote in MA. that is "overwhelming" by any measure, at least in terms of elections. In contrast, W only managed to squeak out 61% of the vote in his home state. should we be alarmed???

.
Chuck you know I have a lot of respect for you, but I have to call you out on this one.....

Here's another *actual* fact.

There are more folks living in TX than MA and one doesn't squeak out 61% in a state as large as Texas. In MA, one could go from end to end in a few hours. If there was ANY squeaking, clearly if you go by the numbers Kerry did the squeaking by in MA. Talk about slanting numbers to support an opinion. I though I was bad.

If you look at the actual numbers you'll see that in MA Bush has a bit over 1 million votes and Kerry had a bit over 1.8 million. Looking at the Texas numbers Bush: 4,526,917 Kerry :2,832,704

These numbers can be found here:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/

Leo touched apon several areas why Kerry lost and it's good to hear one sane Democrat really state some truths.
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Old 09-04-2005, 10:25 AM   #451
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You are right Chikagurl, a little humor every few posts is kinda like arelief valve. Bob
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Old 09-04-2005, 11:03 AM   #452
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie
Chuck you know I have a lot of respect for you, but I have to call you out on this one.....

Here's another *actual* fact.

There are more folks living in TX than MA and one doesn't squeak out 61% in a state as large as Texas. In MA, one could go from end to end in a few hours. If there was ANY squeaking, clearly if you go by the numbers Kerry did the squeaking by in MA. Talk about slanting numbers to support an opinion. I though I was bad.

If you look at the actual numbers you'll see that in MA Bush has a bit over 1 million votes and Kerry had a bit over 1.8 million. Looking at the Texas numbers Bush: 4,526,917 Kerry :2,832,704

These numbers can be found here:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/

Leo touched apon several areas why Kerry lost and it's good to hear one sane Democrat really state some truths.
you're kidding, right?

Neither the number of people, nor the hours required to traverse a state is relevant. that's what "percent" means. it is the equalizer.

"bush is better, because he got 4 million votes in his home state, and Kerry only got 1.7; therefore, the people of MA don't like Kerry much".?????????? THAT is twisting numbers to support an argument.

the FACT is that they both convinced a roughly equal percentage of their home states' voters. Kerry actually convinced a few more.

60%, by any candidate, in ANY election is considered a "landslide."

Leo's implication that Kerry didn't win by "much", nor has "much" support, especially amongst Democrats, is just plain wrong. Certainly, you will find a Dem here in MA that doesn't like him. But there are probably more repubs in TX that don't like bush. does that mean anything? no.

You know, they kept showing those maps of red state/blue state thing so often, I really think people are under the impression that W won a landslide in the whole thing. keep in mind that the election results were something along the lines of "50.00000000000000000000001% to 49.9999999999999999999999". It was almost a repeat of the first election, with Kerry winning the 'college without winning the pop. vote.

Here's a map corrected for population:

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Old 09-04-2005, 12:49 PM   #453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie
These numbers can be found here:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/
Interesting numbers ... let's see if I can distort them just for the fun of it.

Before we get started ... let me first insult the Republicans and the Democrats. The leaders of both parties are a bunch of lying scumbag greaseball weasels. There ... I feel so much better now. On to the numbers ...

Bush won the popular vote by 3 million.

He won the South by a whopping 9 million votes (give that man a mandate ... please!)

However ... if you take away the South ... Kerry won the rest of the nation by 6 million votes!

In Washington I think they call that "spin".
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Old 09-04-2005, 03:03 PM   #454
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Why would I be kidding? You sort of missed the point...it wasn't to traverse a state, but go with it if it helps in some small way.

Bottom line, Bush is President, is on term #2 by majority vote and the college. We are in Iraq, Afghanistan, we have a 100% volunteer military....if you agree with it or not, that's what it all boils down to. I recall being fairly displeased with Clinton, but in the end, there was little one could do about it, but vote the Democrats out for a decade since 2000.....hopefully longer, depending on whose on the menu in 2008. Until then, sit down, complain if you must, and enjoy the ride but it isn't going to change these facts.

I love the arugments where folks say, yea but he only won by, or yea but if you cut up the country this way, our candiate would have won, or there is a goverment big brother who's watching and pulling the strings and the Bush is a puppet. Then when he wins the second term, there is always some reason to belittle the win to make some people's political hurts feel better. It is what it is. Don't blame me, that more of us voted for Bush than Kerry, but you have to take a good long hard look at the Democratic Party and Kerry as a whole and clearly you can see why things turned out as they did and will continue to do so until the Democrats get smart, get some real ground to carve out and stand on. Until then, they are just slinging hash, with little solutions. I mean have you actually listened to the Democrat reponse to any of the Presidents speaches? They are nothing more than a gripe session with no meat.

Best of luck to the Democrats in 2008, Republicans too, I can't see any possible candidates that I would consider voting for yet.

And Chuck you are again wrong with the percentages. Correct numbers can be seen here:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/

2000 was much more close then 2004...2004 had it by about or over 3 million votes....
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Old 09-04-2005, 04:58 PM   #455
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 65GT
Here's an actual fact. My entire family up through all of my uncles and aunts (that's 9 families) are life-long democrats that come from Democratic families (large families). Both my parents are Democrats. I had discussions with almost all of them prior to the election and NONE OF THEM -- not one of them liked or wanted Kerry in office, but they all voted for him. Those are family facts and I've got plenty of MA business contacts that ALL said the same thing.

If you were an actual Kerry supporter, that's great -- somebodies got to believe in something!

I sure as hell didn't see many Kerry bumper stickers or signs up there. I think his reputation in his home state is pretty solidified -- he stinks. Kerry took 62% of the vote for in MA partially for the reasons I stated earlier and what goes hand in hand with that is these same people weren't going to vote republican, or at least for Bush regardless.

No distortion -- I don't know of anyone that was an ardent Kerry supporter. They voted or supported him because he was on the party ticket -- period.

By the way -- I'm not an ardent Busch supporter either -- but the choice (given what it was) was pretty darn clear and ratified!

_
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Amen Leo. I'm voting for you in 2008!

In all seriousness though, I agree with you. Some people just can't let it go.
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Old 09-04-2005, 05:48 PM   #456
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Regardless of who wins, the other side always sounds like its "griping with no meat." Democrat or Republican, they always sound like whining babies when the vote doesn't go their way, in congress, or for president.

And as far as the "I didn't see an Kerry stickers up there?" I think you should take another trip to MA....people still have their Kerry stickers on their cars, like him or not.
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Old 09-04-2005, 05:48 PM   #457
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Here's my favorite map of the election. Red = COUNTIES won by the President. I wonder if there is a difference in the way people in the Big Cities look at things than the rest of us?
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Old 09-04-2005, 06:06 PM   #458
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Here's my favorite map of the election. Red = COUNTIES won by the President. I wonder if there is a difference in the way people in the Big Cities look at things than the rest of us?
Let's try this again.....
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Old 09-04-2005, 07:09 PM   #459
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I posted some of this in another thread, but it needs to be in this one as well because some people need a voice of reason on occasions such as this. If you are offended by the duplication, my apologies.

Now, I have some comments for everyone....

The Mayor of New Orleans, the Governor of Lousiana are BOTH more at fault than The President or Congress.

Fact #1- People were ordered by the Mayor to evacuate.
Fact #2- Some did, some didn't.
Fact #3-NOTHING was done before the disaster by the Mayor or Governor to mobilize infrastructure of public transportation, school busses, etc to get those people being evacuated right now, after the disaster, to move it.
Fact #4- Some of those IDIOTS in New Orleans STILL don't want to leave and are attempting to refuse orders to evacuate even though they are living in a LAKE of disease and sewage etc. This only proves that the people of New Orleans actually did elect one of their own as Mayor.
Fact #5- We are dealing with TWO disasters. The first is the hurricane, which barely MISSED New Orleans. The SECOND disaster is the failure of the LEVY system in N.O. The second disaster is worse than the first because water flows to the lowest point, which is in this case New Orleans. The Asian tsunami washed ashore destroying life as those people knew it, and then washed back into the ocean. This New Orleans "tsunami" isn't going anyplace without a repaired levy, electricity, pumping, and lots of cleanup work.
(Notice that Mississippi and Alabama, although bruised and battered by Katrina, are NOT the subject of 24/7 coverage by CNN and FoxNews as is New Orleans?)
Fact #6- The City of New Orleans, The State Legislature of Louisiana, The CONGRESS and the Executive Branch of the Federal Government, has failed to fund adequate money necessary to build the necessary levy infrastructure and protection necessary for power and pumping stations in New Orleans for DECADES. This is a disaster that has been planned for decades by default....we let it happen for want of doing nothing.
This includes BOTH Democrat and Republican majorities in Congress, and BOTH Democratic and Republican Presidential Administrations.

BOTTOM LINE:
There is enough BLAME to go around. Cussing those holding office right now does no real good.
We are where we are because WE THE PEOPLE let it happen, and now WE THE PEOPLE will pay to pick up the pieces, and hopefully WE THE PEOPLE will LEARN something from the mistakes of the past and we will MOVE ON.

I happen to know the President personally. I have looked him in the eye, and have found him to be a straight shooter. He will make corrections in policy and reccommendatoins to Congress that are necessary to make sure the mistakes revealed in this disaster do NOT happen again.
The President is anything but an idiot.
Although some people's politics may differ from his, he is still YOUR PRESIDENT. We should act respectfully.

Lastly, what the country is dealing with in this is nothing short of several nuclear explosions in terms of amount of destruction across the Gulf States.
What those people that would wish the United States ill should know is this:
Right now we are a little occupied with healing our own land after an unprecidented natural disaster.
We are more than a little sore and irritated about a number of things resulting from this disaster, and our anger and angst is on display in front of the world stage for all the world to see.
But make no mistake, WE are AMERICANS. We will put it back together.
We welcome the help of those who would be willing and able to help us in a time of grief and humanitarian need.
However, if you wish the United States harm and act on that desire, then you should know that we will pull ourselves together despite our grief and differences, and we WILL settle the score.

---now, back to your regular programming---
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Old 09-04-2005, 07:31 PM   #460
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Didn't I say the same thing in my post? Great minds DO think alike, David!

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Old 09-04-2005, 07:52 PM   #461
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Talking Right on!!!!

David -

You have said everything that I have been saying to many of the "unenlightened" that I correspond with both here on the internet and by phone.

But you forgot one thing. This disaster is unique for another reason. We do not have another American city built below sea level. Thank God for small favors.

I'm glad I live in Kansas on a hill, I don't have to worry about floods, and I can see the tornadoes coming. Aunty Em, Aunty Em.......
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Old 09-04-2005, 08:03 PM   #462
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Exclamation Meatloaf cooking times in a convection oven are reduced

Quote:
Originally Posted by silverhawk
It is no wonder to me that this thread keeps riseing to the top of the forum list.
There is so much hot air being expressed here, I have to put on my gas mask just to open it up.
Unlike standard ovens, in which heat moves slowly from the heat source to the food, convection ovens use a fan to move hot air around the oven cavity. Because of this continuous circulation of heat, baked goods release their steam faster, resulting in flakier croissants and pastries, while meats and poultry render their fat more quickly, creating nicely browned skin and juicy meat. And because the heat is more intense, foods in a convection oven generally cook up to 25 percent faster.


Be sure to adjust any meatloaf cooking times in a convection oven by 25%.
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