Anyone flying drones?

[remphoto]

Have been thinking about asking for a quad-copter-type drone for Christmas. It would be neat to take aerial photos and just annoy the neighbors. Any advice on a decent amateur-level brand ($300 -- $700 range)? I saw some youtube footage on the DJI - Phantom 3 standard which looks interesting.

[ghaynes755]

If you want a turn key system Phantom is the one to get. Take your time learning how to fly it. Don't always trust the automation. Make sure you absolutely positively have a GPS lock before takeoff if you ever want it to come back if there is glitch during flight.... Landscape is littered with broken dreams...

And be prepared to register your new drone with the FAA. Likely before Christmas they will publish regulations for all 'drones' whether they are for hobby use or for commercial operations. Feds are tired of harassing and dangerous flights.

[Drathaar]

You'll find that the National Park Service gets a bit more than annoyed. Careful where you fly them.

[cameront120]

If part of your motivation is to annoy the neighbours, hope they aren't adept at skeet shooting.

[rmkrum]

Drones annoying me in my back yard not belonging to me WILL be treated as skeet, downed with prejudice, and the remains will be experimented upon.

Let's see what raw RF power can do to one😄


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[rmkrum]

Of course, I do recall the video of a chimpanzee downing one with nothing more than a long, handy stick😄


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[OTRA15]

Originally Posted by remphoto

[snip]
It would be neat to . . . just annoy the neighbors.
[snip]

Even as a joke, this is not funny IMO. As a statement of actual intent, well . . . let's assume it was a joke.





Most drone owners seem to have lost touch with their role as "good neighbors," both in terms of the potential threat their aerial WEAPON poses, and also about the noise emitted by that weapon, even if its flight is confined to the air space directly over the owner's private property.

An earlier poster referenced using RF as a defensive tool I believe?

Time for some good ol' Internet research, I guess . . .

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by OTRA15

Most drone owners seem to have lost touch with their role as "good neighbors," both in terms of the potential threat their aerial WEAPON poses

Calling a quad-copter aerial photography drone a "weapon" is a bit extreme. It's a camera that flies, not a gun or a bomb. If it crashes into somebody accidentally it can hurt them, but the same thing is true of a bicycle or a skateboard or a baseball. Do you consider those to be weapons as well?

RC model airplanes have been around for decades. RC helicopters have been around for a while as well. No one made a big deal about them until they were renamed "drones" instead of "models."

[OTRA15]

You point is well taken.

The term "weapon" was intended to wake up sleep-walking dreamy-eyed casual drone users to the fact that unregulated drones, used incorrectly, can (and probably will, unfortunately) cause severe damage someday. We are lucky that no drone has yet brought down an airliner, police/news helicopter, etc., IMO. Car crashes and personal injury from direct contact, etc. are other risks. No need to list them all.

We have only begun to see the damage drones will do. Picture thousands of Amazon delivery drones all buzzing around -- landing at your neighbors' houses right next door to your swimming pool area, or next to your campsite in a rural area.

Scary possibilities IMO.

PS -- The OP's joking/cavalier attitude is what got me going. All too common an attitude . . .

[Msmoto]

There will come a time when a drone is involved in an accident in some way. And, as there is no real lobby for the drone industry nor owners, we may see a pilot's license required to fly a drone...all except possibly those which are limited to a hundred feet or so.

And, as the larger units seem to have software controlled by the manufacturer and requiring regular updates, this is the avenue of regulation we may see in the future. One may spend a lot of money on their drone only to find that it will not fly expect in the middle of no where based on software updates imposed by the FAA.

While I would love to have a drone, I think I will wait until all the regs are invoked, then decide. One thing that will no doubt get the attention of law enforcement will be the intrusion into someone's privacy.

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by Msmoto

While I would love to have a drone, I think I will wait until all the regs are invoked, then decide.

Your wait is over. Section 336 of Public Law 112-95— the FAA Modernization and Reform Act of 2012— provides regulations for ALL radio-controlled aircraft under 55 pounds in weight. They must be flown for hobby or recreational use only; flown below an altitude of 400 feet above ground level (AGL); operated in a manner that does not interfere with manned aircraft; can be flown within 5 miles of an airport only with prior notification and approval by the airport's control tower; not near other people or stadiums; and must be flown within line of sight of the operator— the drone's camera does NOT provide line of sight; you must have Mk 1 Mod 1 Eyeball line of sight from the the person at the controls to the drone. Failure to abide by these regulations subjects the operator to a monetary fine.

Within these limits no special permission is needed to fly a drone. All other use, including drone aerial photography for profit, and delivery of packages by Amazon drones, requires case-by-case written approval from the FAA.

That is the Federal level of regulation. States and municipalities have the right to place additional restrictions, but cannot allow fewer restrictions than does the Federal level.

As for private landowners' legal ability to prevent drone overflight on their private property, check out a website called NoFlyZone.org (https://www.noflyzone.org/). This organization is working with several— but not all— drone manufacturers to provide a database of GPS/GIS coordinates delineating no-fly-zones in the drone operating software, and have agreed to include private property along with schools, hospitals, and other public property in their database. But you have to own the property in question and provide land survey data showing the outline of your property boundaries. Landlords could use this to ground drones belonging to their own tenants, I suppose, so the system isn't foolproof.

[OTRA15]

Thank you for the detailed summary.

Welcome to our Brave New World of "system isn't perfect" drone regulation.

Is the law you cite already on the books in full?

What paperwork and controls exist when a private citizen purchases a drone? Is there any registration procedure such as for firearms?

For all the situations requiring FAA review and approval, are we naive enough to think that the commercial users are all going to apply, and that the FAA has sufficient manpower etc. to review the applications in a timely manner?

Is there an online registry of applications and their approval status?

Am I the only one not convinced that the drone situation is under safe and effective control?

Or am I droning on too long?



PS -- FAA link for everyone's further information -- I have not read it yet:

https://www.faa.gov/uas/model_aircraft/

[xrvr]

Just another form of tech that in the wrong hands violates privacy rights of others. Common sense and courtesy go away in the name of fun.

[Lily&Me]

I'm with OTRA15.

Why set out to annoy your neighbors, be that at home or away.

Like so many other things, the potential for abuse has only just begun.

Users are begging for intrusive government regulation because they are unable and/or unwilling to regulate themselves.


Maggie

[OTRA15]

Starting a new post -- apparently there are new rules in the process of being promulgated, but are not yet in force as the Rule of Law. Please correct me if this is wrong. The earlier law simply authorized the FAA to come up with the regs, which they are now doing 3 years later. Wondered why the earlier assurances did not sit right . . .

Links follow:

https://www.faa.gov/uas/nprm/

Overview: https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/rulemaking/media/021515_sUAS_Summary.pdf

The full bill is long: https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/rulemaking/recently_published/media/2120-AJ60_NPRM_2-15-2015_joint_signature.pdf

Section 333 Exemption requests: https://www.faa.gov/uas/legislative_...s/section_333/

As of 10/22 2020 had been granted, and here is the list of them, I think:

https://www.faa.gov/uas/legislative_...uthorizations/

Note that you can toggle the name column to sort in alphabetical order, but there is no address or state column, so that locating a drone operator close to you geographically requires a manual search of over 200 pages of results @ 10 per page!

Seems kind of slanted in favor of one side of this issue, doesn't it? [think FAA -- federal government -- etc.]

[Edit window time approaching stall speed . . . ]

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by OTRA15

Welcome to our Brave New World of "system isn't perfect" drone regulation.

What system of regulations IS perfect? FCC regulations regarding two-way radio use aren't perfect. USCG regulations regarding boating aren't perfect. DOT regulations regarding motor vehicle operation aren't perfect. EPA regulations regarding discharge of pollutants aren't perfect. Why should FAA regulations regarding drone operation be perfect? Perfection is an unattainable goal; as often as not, "good enough" has to BE good enough.

[scamp]

I believe drones can be a lot of fun ,but they need to be used properly I would not consider them as a weapon( at this time ) but they could be used wrongly as flying over your back yard and taking pictures of your personal stuff for theft, or access to your home ( to see if anybodys home, see if a window is open etc ) take pictures of someone sun bathing in your back yard etc , they shouldnt be used over private properties, besides for your own , if used in a public park, should be away from people ,in a open area away from pets and people, used pretty much like model airplanes are used today,I have never ran into a problem with model airplane flyers ( pilots) they have all been courteous it should be the same for drones .i fly model airplanes and have no problems with respecting private property, if a drone flies over my private property and starts hoovering I shoot it down . So in other words respect people and they will respect you. Happy flying!

Don

[OTRA15]

Protagonist --

It's just that the risks are much higher for aerial operations of potential weapons, compared to cars, trucks, boats, two-way radios, and so forth. Add in the relatively low cost of drones, easy availability, geek-appeal, peer pressure, etc. . . .

No need to belabor the point - - -

A "Brave New World" in my personal opinion.


__________________________________________________ _____________

"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely."

Sir John Dalberg-Acton, 8th Baronet, usually referred to simply as Lord Acton
[from Wikipedia]

[Protagonist]

Originally Posted by scamp

if a drone flies over my private property and starts hoovering I shoot it down

Unfortunately, that's called vandalism. The drone is a person's private property, and even if it's in the wrong place at the wrong time, deliberately damaging or destroying it is against the law. Same way that you can't legally slash someone's tires for parking on your lawn uninvited.

If you feel that strongly about drone overflights, allow me to repeat the link to NoFlyZone.org (https://www.noflyzone.org/) so that you can get your property added to the list. Prevention is always better than retribution.

[remphoto]

As OP, I apologize for setting off a firestorm as my attempt at humor was hidden from some in the inernet fog. I just wanted some shared experience on the topic. That said, the responses were instructive of the depth of emotion on the topic. Believe
me, if I was being harassed by a drone, my Ruger Red Label would turn it to dust. But we live in a rural area with a large park system so do not anticipate problems. Also, the model I cited has a 400 ft. ceiling and other safety features.