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Old 04-23-2007, 05:55 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Wabbiteer
NIMBY - a major cause of gasolene price hikes worldwide....

The inability of US refiners to keep up with demand is a constant nusance to the world gasolene spot market. No one in the USA has made a new refinery in 20+ years; and expansion and renewal at operating plants can't happen when they are working 101% capacity; so we are stuck paying commodities traders top dollar to make-up real or perceived shortfalls, and the trading houses love to feel important so act on every news-byte that is uttered... And don't even think about muttering 'Hurricane"!

A energy chicken-and-the-egg conumdrum...
You are 110% right.But not in my back yard has not help when you can not build or expand refineries because no one wants one in there back yard and all the Gov green fokes take years to get one approved if you lucky. Commodities traders they serve no usefull purpuse.


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Old 04-23-2007, 06:48 PM   #16
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$267.9 at Sam's in Southhaven, MS, today...

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Old 04-23-2007, 07:09 PM   #17
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After reading all these posts, everyone forgot about the election. Did anyone notice the decrease just before and after? You might buy all that BS the politicians and oil marketing people want you to believe. If it is supply and demand, no one buy gas or fuel on the weekend and see if the prices go down.(not) As a construction trades crane operator, I have worked on too many oil refineries for that capacity thing to hold any weight. The oil companies like the drug companies have all the government people in their back pocket and can do and charge whatever they want. The commodies market know what they are doing too.(record profits). If everyone on this thread would call their congressmen, it might do some good, but the election is over. I called all of mine last week and only one took my address. Before the election, those that were running called me back personally and expressed a desire to solve the problem and they all agreed that it might be just greed on the oil companies part.(go figure)
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Old 04-23-2007, 07:22 PM   #18
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lighter A/S possible

Pulling a 19' Bambi with my Sprinter last fall, I averaged 17 mpg (my normal mileage is 22-23). Diesel fuel has become a premium product, though.
That's about the max I can pull - 5000#, however,and that's pushing the rating to the limit. It felt just fine, though, and the trailer only made itself known on hills. What I'd love to have is one of the Airstreams they've started selling in Europe. Check out
About 22 ft overall length, just over 3000#. A bit narrower, and the only tradeoff from our Bambi is that you have to make up the bed from the dinette every day. I think it's not actually Airstream that's building them, but probably a European licensee. A/S will need to sell them here as fuel becomes more of an issue, IMHO.
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Old 04-23-2007, 07:32 PM   #19
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I just priced Fiji bottled water by the case: $8.35/gallon.

Haven't heard too many people complaining about that.

Milk's approching $4.00/gallon haven't heard too many people complaining about that.

The last time I checked it's way easier making clean water and getting milk than it is gasoline.

The company making the most money per gallon of gasoline is the US Federal Govt. What work have they done to collect a nice percentage of the work required to produce the fuel we use?
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Old 04-23-2007, 07:36 PM   #20
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My wife paid $3.26 gal for regular gas on I-5 north of Seattle on Saturday. Regular gas in BC is around $1.209 per L. (3.785 L per US gal). Exchange rate was $0.891 to go from Canadian to US$, or US$ is worth 1.1223 to a Canadian $. That puts us over the $4 per US gal mark. Not a pretty sight, but it's a fact of life.

For us the easy way to get around this is drink Rotten Ronnie's coffee instead of Starbucks and cook in the trailer a few more times than we would normally and it all evens out the cash flow. At least we're out in the trailer enjoying life. Also shorter driving trips which means less wear and tear on the vehicles (and us) as we enjoy the areas everyone else comes to see. One advantage of living in the mountains on the coast is you don't have to go too far to feel like you are far away from home.

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Old 04-23-2007, 07:41 PM   #21
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Gas prices

Don't forget that there is a significant tax built in to the price of gas! We can't forget to thank our government officials for taking more of our money.
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Old 04-24-2007, 07:39 AM   #22
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Here in Minnesota they are planning on 10-cents a gallon increased fuel tax "to help with highway maintenance" - I think it's because less fuel is being used so less tax revenue being collected; and that is on top of the mandatory ethanol which increases volume sold "per-gallon" taxes collected since ethanol is a 15% mileage deduction.

The refining capacity & futures market is real - at an individual level the diffusion of responsibility is so great it is exceeding the natural order human scale of comprehension. If supply exceeds demand prices would drop so supply has been maintained on the narrowest of margins...

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Old 04-24-2007, 10:13 AM   #23
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WV just raised their gas tax 7 cents per gallon Jan. 1 for the same reason; people are driving a whole lot less due to the high fuel prices and so the state wasn't bringing in the revenue that they were before. So, in their infinite wisdom, they raised taxes.

I thought the reason diesel used to always be cheaper than gasoline was because it takes less refining. Octane isn't a magic thing you pour in, but it takes higher levels of refinement of the basic product to get the octane ratings to increase. That's why 93 costs more than 87. But why is diesel now higher than regular? Is it because its an "industrial" fuel and it has to be bought to "keep the wheels turning?" The wheels of society? Less discretionary use of diesel than gasoline and so "they've got us?"

Other than cabinetry and other interior appointments, why are the Airstreams of today so much heavier than those of 30-40 years ago? I know they put a real frame under them now, but that should only equate to a few hundred pounds...
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Old 04-24-2007, 01:48 PM   #24
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Here in NW Wa. state regular is at $3.25 a gallon while Diesel is at $2.95 a gallon. We live about 20 miles from a refrinery. Elsewhere in the state regular is under $3.00 per gallon. The Governor just announced that the state is starting an investigation as to why the price varies so much within the state and, sometimes, within 50 miles. Should be interesting.

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Old 04-24-2007, 03:16 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by bikrmikey
In Europe there are tiny economy cars pulling sizeable travel trailers. Why are our trailers so heavy? Even a current Airstream is heavy. Look at the weight of the 50s Airstream trailers, do we need the extra weight today? Many of the 50s trailers are still around.

Of course I drive a gas engine and have a somewhat heavy Airstream so I better not cast the first stone.
Not to pick on you Mike, but do you think Airstream buyers today would settle for an Airstream that doesn't have a gray water tank? What about a 10 gallon fresh water tank? Do you think they could get by with a goffer hole in a camp ground? Would they settle for a gaucho instead of a queen island bed in that Classic's bedroom? Would a pipe frame pass safety inspection today? Would a buyer today buy an Airstream without A/C? What about a converter or batteries? What about a two burner stove instead of a three? Would you buy a new Airstream without a microwave oven? What about only two overhead storage bins? Would you want a smaller 'fridge? Would you give up carpet for vinyl tile floors? Would a single gas cylinder be enough for your camping needs?

Now these questions weren't directed toward Mike specifically. He just happened breach the question about why today's Airstreams weigh more than those of the 1960's did. I am glad mine does. And I can assure you my wife does more than I do and she was an accountant in her previous career.

I think corporate greed in general is responsible for high gas prices as well as government greed. The stock holders aren't going to complain with the board or with the CEO and Chairman as long as profits are high. The government isn't going to complain as long as tax revenues are high...or maintenance expenses are lower because of fewer miles driven on highways. There is no incentive on either side for lower prices. The general population has no leverage because we have no where else to turn for automobiles. If things were as bad energy wise as we are told, some country somewhere would have an alternative. I can't believe there is a conspiracy that is that big that some country can't break out of the mold and fix it for themselves.
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Old 04-24-2007, 04:34 PM   #26
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I'm in Orlando - the gas station charging $3.99/gal is out near the tourist attractions/airport, where a lot of folks just seem to pull in and fill up without even looking at the price. There are also a lot of foreign tourists who may think $4 is not too bad. After the story was on the news last night, though, I wouldn't be surprised if they dropped it a bit. It wasn't a flattering story - basically implied price gouging.

Typical price here is closer to $2.89.

I think the dramatic increases are the gas co's way of desensitizing us all to increasing prices - ever notice how it always seems to go up $1.00, come down $0.90, go up a $1.00, come down $0.90, and so on. It's not going to stop. Will just keep creeping up from here on.

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Old 04-24-2007, 04:44 PM   #27
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It's greed, it's lawmakers basically sitting on their brains and it's automakers only slowly adopting alternate methods of transportation. I wrote a few letters to my Federal Representitives and got nothing back but smoke and mirrors. Folks say the current administration is the cause, but both sides of the aisle are to blame, some more than others, but they are all guilty of squandering the oppportunites we've had. It becomes even more clear when you look at Brazil and E85. All automakers make E85 vehicles, try to find a gas station for it. Few and far between, plus E85 takes more resources to make than gas, and it's only moderately less exp than gasoline.

I'm a big GM fan, but I also will lay HUGE blame on GM for killing the EV1. Even folks that would never buy a GM car and were fortunate enough to get their hands on an EV1, loved those cars. What did GM do (and the rest of the EV car manfacs), they got crushed, and they were perfectly good.

Sure little of what I've discussed makes a big difference to folks like us that tow, but most of us don't tow everyday. For those of us that can use an electric, hybrid or plugin hybrid that was priced similar to that of a normal car, we could all do that, but it could be years before we see that happen if even then.

Bottom line I'm near my limit for fuel prices. Seems there are always reasons why it just happens to go up before a holiday or the summer driving season.

You want to see a somewhat slanted movie, go see Who Killed the Electric Car. Draw you're own conclusions.
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Old 04-24-2007, 06:27 PM   #28
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So little time and bandwidth today but I had to chime in on this thread. I fill my 60 gal. tank every other day or so as I travel and work out of Airstream One.
The way this price affects my bottom line is disasterous. I tried to travel smarter last summer when prices topped out. My sales showed. I've ditched some of my lower commission lines for newer higher commission lines and now have to travel more to introduce them. It's catch 22.
The only folks happy with all this are the oil men (know any in politics?) and the oil company stock holders.
Profit is not a dirty word... but windfall profits at the expense of the lower and middle class of America will sooner or later have a backlash.
I'm already thinking of a Sprinter but the ROI will take some time over my paid for classic.

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