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Old 02-08-2005, 08:46 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Chaplain Kent
I was encouraged when the repair shop admitted fault but now I have spoken with the insurance company. The adjuster told me the filter was correct only the #s were different from Carquest to NAPA. Further he stated that it was not possible to put the wrong size filter into the cannister.
Unless you sat on it that is not the correct filter, it has been crushed. The metal joining the ends of the paper should be straight, the paper is crushed. To say there is no way to install a wrong element is ridiculous, the mechanic did it and admitted he did (I would start every conversation with the adjuster with that statement). There is no failsafe on a element type filter, if it will fit in the canister and you can pick up the threads it will go on. The mechanic turned it until he thought it was tight, all he accomplished was to crush it until it felt tight but did not seal. Look underneath near the filter and trans and see if it isn't wet, take some pictures.

Has Standard Truck Center drained the oil yet? If not have them do it and see how much. Should be full with a little over 100 miles since it was changed.

The invoice should have the filter number, sometimes one is inked on the metal of the filter. Do they match? Does this number match the one Napa/Carquest call out? Start calling and ask them their numbers, ask if the number they used crosses to the other brand.

Quote:
I asked him how the filter became so distorted and he said it was probably from a sudden surge in oil pressure.
Oil pressure is limited by a check valve in every pump I have ever seen. They are very simple and dependable, a ball bearing and spring, not a lot to fail. And if it failed the spring would break/weaken and pressure would go down. I would also ask why a surge in pressure collapsed the filter vertically instead of blowing it out, the oil comes from the inside not the top. There aren't any holes that I can see, and even if there were all you would loose is filtration. Not the best for the engine, but not fatal in that short a distance either.

But the best of all is the mechanic admitted it is the wrong filter; the adjuster is running a line of ridiculous crap and if he has a clue about engines he knows it and knows they will have to pay.

John
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Old 02-08-2005, 10:10 PM   #30
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Sorry to read about your problem with the motor. Here is my 2 cents if you don't mind.
Let me get the facts right
The camper when in for an "oil change" and after 100 mile drive the motor blew up.
If this is correct then you have to pin point how did the motor fail.
You can take a sample of the oil and send it out and they can tell you "what went loose", so let say the oil pressure dropped, I would ask why and how. Did all the oil leak out because the filter was install improper and "crushed" or did the oil pump failed. From what I read it sounds like the oil dropped out from a leak from the oil can, and if so the shop can be liable for the problem. As for the insurance company you are talking to "teckie" they may now a bit of motor stuff but there job is not to pay you.
Now who is going to pay?
In my state New York small claims court only goes up to $3000.00 its a really simple to file for, but its' only 3 g's still short $11000.00. Take the shop to court and have an expert sign off on the improper oil filter install.On that alone they already admitted to and you should win on the shops own guilt. Let them fight there insurance company for the lost.

Or you can retain a lawyer and give him $3000.00 to start and let it take about 1-2 years to go to court system and state your case and then the judge may take the total claim of $20000.00 chop it in half because there is a small chance that the motor was getting old ( and also the judges no zippo about cars/RV's) so the total won was $10000.00 at the best and then the lawyer when to court charged you $3000 up front+$2000.00 for the day in court day Now your total won is only $5000.00 paid back to you. My question is $2000.00 difference in from small claims court and the " big " court+ 2 years time all worth it.

3 option Texas Justas w/ Judge Larry (thats $5000.00)

I hope you you make out ok with this problem . Any input you may need just ask.Jim
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Old 02-08-2005, 11:09 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulaFord
Be aware that if you file a claim on your insurance, your rates will go up EVEN IF the claim is disallowed (good advice from MY agent!). If your insurance agent is good and a good friend, ask for advice but DON'T file a claim.

Paula & Tin Lizzie
I disagree and no one can make such a blanket statement that applies to all situations.

I've had at least 2 things happen to vehicles in which I've made claims against my insurance due to issues that were the other person's fault. My insurance dealt with it, I paid my deduct, my insurance company went after the other guy, and both times, got my deduct back and the car was fixed. As a matter of fact, my rates have continually gone down, not up as suggested.

A third event that wrecked my garage, was also paid out (thousands of $$) and no increase in premiums.

In this case, I'm not sure a claim can be filed, but I doubt it would increase the premiums at all given the fault that appears to be on the folks that did the work and most personal insurance doesn't cover issues like this...but as one person said, it's a classic coach, not some SOB.
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Old 02-08-2005, 11:53 PM   #32
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I have been tinkering on cars all my life....no really. there are pictures of me helping my dad at 4 and 5. I was adoing oil changes and djusting valves on the family car at 10.

That filter is not blown out its crushed. On a canister filter you will still get oil circulation with NO filter. However if the filter does not let the canister seal it will leak out and leak out FAST.

If there is no oil in the crank case and the only wet spot is around that filter then there are two conclusions. Leak at filter or no oil was ever put in the engine. Either way that is the shops fault.

Insurance adjusters job is to try not to pay you. Point out that you know that and point out your lawyers job is to get as much as he can and if he takes it as portion of the settlement then the lawer wil surly go for 30-40k to maximize his part. With the mechanic admitting fault you have a no lose case. Courts for the most part have no loss of love for insurance companies.


Do you have it in writing that the mechanic admitted fault? GET IT NOW IF YOU DON'T.

Also find your states insurance commissioners office. Give them a ring. They might be able to fix this with a single call. I had a go around with some knuckle head insurance company that said I was 20% at fault in a accident. Funny I was not even moving where their client ran a stop sign and T boned me when I had right of way making a turn. Insurance commissioners office had it resolved in a day once they had a copy of the accident report.
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Old 02-08-2005, 11:59 PM   #33
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Here is your insurance commissioners office website.
http://oci.wi.gov/
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Old 02-09-2005, 07:32 AM   #34
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good tips on the filter and such. That filter did not get that way from oil pressure, they know that too.
I was in a court case where an engine blew in a brand new car. The folks got the car replaced and a cash settlement on top of that...the dealer was guilty of selling the car with a replacement engine..long story. But the point is the court ruled in favor of the car owner and socked it to the dealer/repair facility. So that does happen.
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Old 02-09-2005, 07:54 AM   #35
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Surge? What Surge?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaplain Kent
..... I asked him how the filter became so distorted and he said it was probably from a sudden surge in oil pressure.....
Hope you documented this idiots name -

The only "surge" (pressure) source is the oil pump - normally puts out between 3 and 5 GPM per 1000 RPM - the pressure "surges" each and every time the engine is started.

As stated above, pump is usually internally protected as well the internal bypass integral to most all oil filter/canister assemblies.

MAKE SURE YOU DOCUMENT ALL FURTHER COMMUNICATION - WITH EVERYONE!!!!

Time - who you talked with - notes of the conversation.

As much as I hate to mention the "L" word, I am afraid it is time you talked with one. The quicker you bring this thing to an end the better off you will be - time is on the side of the mechanic shop and the insurance company.

Anyone have any good lawyer jokes they could PM me with?
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Old 02-09-2005, 08:10 AM   #36
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Be careful joking about lawyers. They don't have a sense of humor.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/nation...Lawyer%20Jokes

But if you want to take the chance

http://members.aol.com/twh427/lawyer.htm

John
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Old 02-09-2005, 09:33 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 74Argosy24MH
Be careful joking about lawyers. They don't have a sense of humor.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/nation...Lawyer%20Jokes


John
The truth hurts sometimes.
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Old 02-09-2005, 02:19 PM   #38
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Update

I called Airstream and got the oil filter # from them. Next I called Carquest and ordered an oil filter. When I compared the two oil filters they were not the same. The crushed oil filter measured 1/8 inch taller even in its crushed state and had a domed top. The numbers did not match. I next called Carquest again and ordered a new filter with the numbers on the old filter. They did not have one in stock but said it would be in first thing in the morning. I then asked if it was the same filter as the # I had just bought and they said no they were two different filters.
I called the insurance adjuster and left him a message as to my findings.
Thanks for all the great advice; by the way I also told the insurance adjuster that my reasearch has found that there is no such thing as "sudden surge of oil pressure" and that yes indeed the wrong size filter can be forced into a canister. A good friend and restorer of cars told me to not let them push me around which is hard for me to do. I can not tell you how much I appreciate the support and advice I get am getting from this forum.
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Old 02-09-2005, 05:37 PM   #39
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Pursuit of the guilty

I can only assume that the guilty party has some level of insurance coverage, least they assigned an adjuster. This is a good sign.

Well ... this could turn out to be an 'opnion' case that could have no merit if the owner of the filter (you) had no facts. Normaly the facts, in preparation of a court case, are developed by a Professional Engineer.

Apparently, in your case, the adjuster failed to build a case to facts and simply rendered an opinion. Further, from his statements, he is not an expert on filters nor the inner workings of an engine; and no tests were conducted.

Usually the filter has to be tested with a new and old to determine the results. The test is the only way to find out what happened ... You have determined that the filter utilized is an incorrect size and may have attributed to the failure of the cannister to seal, leading to oil loss and engine failure.

I would suggest that the word 'BAD FAITH' be utilized with both the adjuster and their underwriter. That word is usually the key to getting them off their denial position. At least they may get further involved to determine the exact cause of failure to factually determine if this is a covered loss under the garage keepers policy.

Good luck. Professional representation may be required if your 'Bad Faith' card doesn't play well.
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Old 02-19-2005, 07:50 PM   #40
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Hello.
I bought a 310 Turbo vehicle with a blown Isuzu and replaced it with a Cummins engine. These things really work and will outperform that Isuzu by a wide margin.
Joe Pospisil
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Old 02-22-2005, 01:26 PM   #41
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The Insurance Comapany Speaks

We have just heard from General Casualty Insurance Co. They have turned down the claim stating that their investigation turned up no evidence that the filter in question was wrong or could of been the cause of the engine failure. The adjuster denied that the shop who did the work admitted blame and that the shop who now has the coach attributed the failure to the filter. Please note this is General Casualty Insurance Co. Next stop will be our lawyer.
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Old 02-22-2005, 02:48 PM   #42
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Did you get in touch with the insurance commisioners office and have them contact the insurance company?


Good luck with it.
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