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Old 09-16-2008, 05:38 AM   #99
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I am not the type to usually refer to a previous thread but, http://www.airforums.com/forums/f381...ize-38764.html I asked all that too.

The solid rivets are available through Aircraft Spruce, or Byler, or Airparts inc. Someone else will chime in here with another place. They will have a gold coating on them and some numbers stamped into the head, but they are the ones. You will need a range of sizes 5-4, 5-5, 5-6
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Old 09-16-2008, 07:24 AM   #100
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He is very right about every aspect of those olympics and solid rivets except one thing.... it only takes about three solid rivets to get the hang of it...
Hey! I was giving the boy some lead way! hehe! One thing that you do need to practice, though is getting the pressure right on the gun. When you hammer it down, the back should only be 50% larger than the original diameter for optimum grip. If you have the pressure set too high, it will flatten out like a penny on the train tracks. Whatever you do, DON'T point the rivet gun at anyone! It seems harmless, but if that spring breaks, the head will go flying!

I know, it sounds scary. I think it took me 4 rivets to figure it all out. You do most learning on the job anyway! ha!

JP
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Old 09-16-2008, 07:48 AM   #101
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Practice with a buddy as this is how you will be installing them. It does not take long to develop a rhythm. After awhile you can tell if the rivet is completely shot by the noise of the bar a the vibration of the gun.

Kip
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Old 09-16-2008, 09:21 AM   #102
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Hey man, Great work!

I understand what you're planning on doing with the belly, but I would caution against relying on olympic rivets. I planed on replacing a panel on my Trade Wind with them, and was advised against it by the VAP guys (episode 70). You really should consider getting a rivet gun and bucking in solid rivets. You can order a used gun online at the yard store, or even find one on ebay pretty cheap.

Olympics really aren't as strong as solid rivets, and the point where the trailer attaches to the floor channel is one of the most structurally important pieces of the trailer. I don't think it would fly off in transit or anything, but all the bouncing around will loosen the rivets over time. If you can remove the lower walls on the interior, you'll have no problem bucking in solids. It takes about 10 rivets to learn the technique, so practice on some scrap metal.

Another thing that will potentially (if not almost CERTAINLY) happen when you use Olympic rivets is this. The rivet, when tightened, expands 3 or 4 legs perpendicular to the rivet against the skin. This pulls the front of the rivet down and forms the bond. I use Olympics all the time for patches where it's just 2 pieces of aluminum skin. The problem comes when you try to rivet into a channel, and those extending legs on the back can't fully extend. The rivet won't get a good bond, and the stem will snap off before it's come out of the head enough to sand it smooth. This will make it look like a pop-rivet, and leave a hole for water to get into.

Take a look at the attached pic of a patch I did on my globe trotter. There are 2 rivets on the left side of the outer curve that ended up going into the ribs. See how the heads have a hole in them? It will frustrate you to no end! When I remove the interior skin on this one, I'm planning on replacing those 2 with solids and FINALLY getting the haunting images of an Olympic with a root canal out of my head! I think I tried it 2 or 3 times and this was the best I could do. :S

That's my 2 rivet's worth!

Jordan
Jordan-- wow, that's really informative, thanks for the visual. I've probably read your thead 4 times now, and I've seen that picture at least a dozen times, and I never noticed that before.

Someday I think we will be able to set up this site with a wiki-style reference system, I know the admins and mods have talked about that. Before you drill those out and replace with solids, I think it would be a great idea to take a close-up shot of that, so that it can be added to a reference library at some point. Those are the types of visuals that really help n00bs like me to understand what is right, and what is wrong, when repairing our own trailers.

Very cool, thanks.

-Marcus
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Old 09-16-2008, 01:56 PM   #103
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Air Compressor Suggestions

Would love a suggestion for a portable air compressor to run the ATS Aircraft Rivet Gun. One caveat: I would like to run it off my Honda generator and not off home power. I was hoping I could find a small one that does not pull to many amps and then it would play nice nice with my generator. The gun specs says: 3CFM required at 90 psi.
Thanks all,
J
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Old 09-16-2008, 02:22 PM   #104
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Quote:
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....................... The problem comes when you try to rivet into a channel, and those extending legs on the back can't fully extend. The rivet won't get a good bond, and the stem will snap off before it's come out of the head enough to sand it smooth. This will make it look like a pop-rivet, and leave a hole for water to get into.
....................
A trick I saw on some post somewhere is to cut off one the three legs of the rivet before compressing. Rotate the rivet so that the missing leg is what would have jammed against the channel. This will allow the rivet to fully compress before it pops and leave a solid shank that can be shaved. This probably does not leave as solid a connection, but probably just as solid as a partially compressed rivet. I have done this and it works. Just a suggestion. So go out there drill those rivets and put new ones in with no holes. Oh, and send new pictures.

Gene
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Old 09-16-2008, 05:15 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aerowood View Post
Practice with a buddy as this is how you will be installing them. It does not take long to develop a rhythm. After awhile you can tell if the rivet is completely shot by the noise of the bar a the vibration of the gun.

Kip
Oh yeah, def! If it sounds like your hitting an anvil with a hammer, you got it... if it sounds like a drum, STOP or you'll damage the skin!

JP
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Old 09-16-2008, 06:25 PM   #106
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What I need

So what I need is

MS20470AD5-4 more of
MS20470AD5-5 less of

I know this is annoying, but I have gone to 3 separate websites. There seems to be alot of rivets out there. Can anyone send me a link to the exact rivets I mentioned above. I am usually not high maintenance, but I want to go ahead and order this stuff and make sure I am ordering it right.

Is this too much to ask, please.

I have ordered the rivet gun and a 5/32 rivet set, I have an air compressor.

Oh, what kind of aluminum should go on the belly, thickness, specific type of aluminum.

Finally, What is everyone's thoughts on spraying closed-cell foam on the underside of a trailer? Someone mentioned it to me. I am hesitant since it is so permanent and would tend to trap water between it and the subfloors if water leaks. What about Polyurea? I am thinking it would be best to simply stick with Reflectix and foam board, wiring in conduit.

Gotta go give some attention to my fairy princess, Andrew
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Old 09-16-2008, 06:41 PM   #107
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I would recommend .025 for the belly. You'll have a bear of a time bending .032. There's a place down by the jail where I got mine. I didn't use alclad on my belly. It never shows anyway. If you go non-alclad, you can get it in 4X10 sheets for something like $30 a sheet (the price may have changed). Alclad in that size will run you $250 easy.

I wouldn't do the foam underneath. In fact, I wouldn't put any insulation under it. I put the bubble stuff under my little one, but the trade wind insulation has all but fallen out. Unless you go in sub 0 weather, you won't miss it, and you can get in the belly without having to carve out a mess in the future.

my 2 rivets! (solid, of course!)

JP
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Old 09-16-2008, 08:09 PM   #108
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here you go my man....Solid Aluminum Rivets from Aircraft Spruce

get 1/4 pound of each... 5-4, 5-5, 5-6
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Old 09-16-2008, 08:10 PM   #109
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and that is a 3X gun right?
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Old 09-16-2008, 11:42 PM   #110
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Frank, is the x number how hard it hits? I know the higher the x the longer the snout but is there any other difference? Aprox. how many rivets per pound? I'm starting to surf ebay now!

John (NUTZ)
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Old 09-17-2008, 04:07 AM   #111
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John, I do not know the answer. I asked what I needed and Aerowood recommended the Brown tool kit that is linked in that solid rivet size thread. I did not shop around, I did not try and find a better deal, or something close. I had seen his work, read many posts that Aerowood made and felt he was steering me in the right direction. The kit has many heads and do a few different size rivet heads. It also has a pair of bucking bars, so just about any situation is covered. I am very happy with the tool and feel it will be with me for my entire life.
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Old 09-17-2008, 05:35 AM   #112
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Rivets and gun

Quote:
Originally Posted by 62overlander View Post
and that is a 3X gun right?

Thanks man for the rivets, just ordered them. The gun I purchased is

2602A | Aircraft Tool Supply

Aerowood recommended it to me. I think that is all of the ordering I can do this week. I began to take the interior skins off yesterday. Found a colony of ants living near a vent pipe, I hate the ant bites on the face.

Have a great day. Andrew
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