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Old 11-21-2018, 11:20 AM   #2841
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The main difference in the two is that the EMS-PT30X give you a read out of Status ie amp draw, voltage and error codes where as the SSP does not.

Does the EMSprovide more protection?


Which model do you use? I'm debating between the SSP-30XL and the EMS-PT30X.

The EMS is more than twice as expensive as the SSP- Do I need that?
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Old 11-21-2018, 11:27 AM   #2842
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Does the EMSprovide more protection?


Which model do you use? I'm debating between the SSP-30XL and the EMS-PT30X.

The EMS is more than twice as expensive as the SSP- Do I need that?
I don’t think it provides more protection just more information.
I use the 30amp hardwired unit with remote.
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Old 11-21-2018, 11:29 AM   #2843
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After this huge stock price drop, maybe some older heads will roll down the driveway at Jackson Center and new ones interested in preserving an icon will be installed......

Thor has become the largest RV conglomerate in the US with quality degradation in nearly every thing they touch. Their bottom line would double if the QC was done at build time and warranty repairs dropped off. But I digress, they expect the dealership to fix the sloppy build. Wrong party as the dealership wants to fix the issues only if the customer finally finds them and are out of warranty...

I am not sure the phrase "factory trained mechanics" is reassuring if they learn the sloppy work ethic of the factory.
We have to remember that Airsteam represents only a small portion of THOR. I would like to know how the Airstream Profit and Loss and balance sheets look.
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Old 11-21-2018, 12:52 PM   #2844
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Quality (or lack thereof)

I was making the point about lack of quality control and sloppy craftsmanship earlier. It is appalling. But all this is explained by lack of competion. Airstream stands alone, because the rest of American-made RVs are, at best, awful. Perhasps nuCampis the only exception, but their trailers don’t yet compete with Airstream. This will change as they showed a prototype for a larger trailer that will be the first possible competitor to Airstream.

But competition has done wonders in Europe, where there are at least a dozen brands of caravans that are as good or better than those made by Airstream. And they cost a third... Competition means that if you make a crappy product you won’t sell, because your customers will chose a better made product from your competitor.
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Old 11-21-2018, 04:59 PM   #2845
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I just wanted to take a moment to wish you all a Happy Thanksgiving.
If you are traveling this year, safe travels!
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Old 11-21-2018, 05:29 PM   #2846
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I just wanted to take a moment to wish you all a Happy Thanksgiving.
If you are traveling this year, safe travels!
Thanks, Keith, and may I also wish a wonderful Thanksgiving to you and all our friends here at 23D Central! Gratitude is always best when shared, and it's nice that this little group shares so much!

Rob & Libda
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Old 11-21-2018, 05:51 PM   #2847
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Thanks, Keith, and may I also wish a wonderful Thanksgiving to you and all our friends here at 23D Central! Gratitude is always best when shared, and it's nice that this little group shares so much!

Rob & Libda
Love all you guys. Have a safe and great day tomorrow. We are all blessed in so many ways.
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Old 11-22-2018, 06:19 AM   #2848
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Originally Posted by CindyH View Post
Does the EMSprovide more protection?


Which model do you use? I'm debating between the SSP-30XL and the EMS-PT30X.

The EMS is more than twice as expensive as the SSP- Do I need that?
I have one season and about 2000 miles of travel with my 23cb, so I am not as experienced with campground power connections as many others here. I bought the EMS-PT30X because, according to the PI website, it provides additional protection for over and under voltage which some people have said can be a problem. It also provides protection for “accidental” 240v connection. According to the website, the SSP- does not provide these additional protections. I also like the voltage and current read outs, though they are not essential.
-Bert
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Old 11-22-2018, 07:18 AM   #2849
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Happy Thanksgiving to all and the "Tweak" Masters on this thread!

The perfect day would be in a remote area looking at sunrise coming over the mountains or fish jumping in the lake.

Alas, that is not an option for us.......
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Old 11-22-2018, 09:14 AM   #2850
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Happy Thanksgiving. I am thankful for many things, but especially this community and all of the great people I have met and the ideas that you all come up with to make camping and life better. Enjoy the day!
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Old 11-22-2018, 09:44 AM   #2851
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Happy Thanksgiving

Happy Thanksgiving to all on the Airforums. I am thankful to be able to be a part of this community. I have met some new friends with common interests. You guys are the best, thanks for all the ideas and patience. Don't eat too much today,get a good nap in and hug all family and friends. Scott and Natalie
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Old 11-23-2018, 09:59 AM   #2852
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Hi,
I'm looking for the product information for the interior design pieces for my 2013 Flying Cloud with the Golden Night color scheme. Specifically, I'm looking for the actual name and product number for the laminate on the counter tops, the drapery material...those things. Would somebody please direct me to the source for that information? Many thanks.
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Old 11-23-2018, 08:57 PM   #2853
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Ok so I can now say for sure my trailer has NO leaks. After pulling 13 hrs in a monsoon today from OKC to Jackson MS. Whew what a day, but trailer dry a cozy.
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Old 11-24-2018, 06:00 AM   #2854
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Hi,
I'm looking for the product information for the interior design pieces for my 2013 Flying Cloud with the Golden Night color scheme. Specifically, I'm looking for the actual name and product number for the laminate on the counter tops, the drapery material...those things. Would somebody please direct me to the source for that information? Many thanks.
Cindy, have you looked here?


https://www.airstream.com/service/manuals/

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Old 11-24-2018, 07:13 PM   #2855
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Home this afternoon. 2100 miles and 9 nights of flawless performance from our 23D.
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Old 11-24-2018, 11:22 PM   #2856
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Home this afternoon. 2100 miles and 9 nights of flawless performance from our 23D.
Ronnie,

That is a quick trip and a fair amount of mileage, good to hear all is well.

Thanks again Ronnie for the measurements on the lift blocks, your numbers saved us a lot of time with this project. We installed the lift on Black Friday and all went well, about 5 hours all told. The blocks lined up perfectly and with the aid of pneumatic equipment it all came apart quickly and went back together without much fuss. We double and triple checked our alignment measurements before tightening the axles and this took an additional 30 minutes.

It is super nice having the LP line to the hot water heater follow the same route as stock along the bottom of the trailer, above the axles. The LP one only took a few minutes to remove and another few minutes to put back. Before proceeding, we turned the LP off at the tanks and bled by turning on the hot water tank. I could easily hear it ignite and then within a few seconds it went out. We turned the hot water tank off and I disconnected the LP line.

I wrote to Ronnie last evening about something unforeseen in all of this. We expected that the bolt holes in the frame would all be CNC placed to match our 2013 Dexter #10 axle holes. Instead we discovered that only the two front axle flange bolts went through actual drilled holes in the frame--these were both CNC holes. There were other CNC holes in the frame for attaching an axle, but they were all positioned in the wrong location.

All the other six axle mounting bolt holes were cut with a plasma cutter through the frame instead of being drilled. These holes were extremely irregular, vertically elongated, and jagged. In one spot the flashing actually spot welded the Dexter axle flange to the frame which was not easy to pull apart. None of the torched frame holes were painted or prepped in any way and we were looking at a shocking amount of rust on a trailer that has no rust or oxidation anywhere else. We were pressed for time and had no choice accept to bolt through it and build it back in place with our new spacer blocks. None of this could be seen due to the size of the washers that covered up the jagged holes areas during the original assembly. A tell-tail is that rust is extending out on the frame from underneath the bolt washers.

In a few months we will pull the new outer nuts and washers, and cleanup the rust around each of these six jagged frame holes. We may also add a steel plate on the outside of frame that will support this mess with actual drilled holes. We did not have time yesterday to do this side project properly, so we will come back to it.

It is very clear that Airstream workers were not interested in properly drilling the frame so that the Dexter axle flange bolts would actually sit in a round hole in the frame--back to our recent discussion about time and money. On our 23D this shoddy work is a rusty mess and is where the axles are bolted to the frame. None of this can be inspected unless the original nuts are loosened on the inside of the frame and the outer bolts and washers are pulled back for viewing.

My guess is that newer 23Ds/23CBs that have upgraded Dexter axles may actually fit the CNC holes in the frame. I cannot imagine why our 2013 frame was specified the way it was and not have holes set to match up with the Dexter axles, really strange.

At any rate, we are very happy with the 3" lift and the stance of the Airstream looks quite good. It is not overly tall and with the upgraded 15" rim and tire size it all looks proportionally correct. It is very nice having an additional 4.5 inches of clearance under the rear plumbing (1.5" from the radius of the rim/tire increase and 3" from the lift blocks), which was one of our goals with the rim/tire/lift upgrades. Also our 23D frame is now closer to being in line horizontally with our Toyota Land Cruiser frame.

Last night and today, we overhauled the tire hanger so that our larger spare tire would fit nicely and MIG welded on two horizontal steel pieces across the hanger. Paint went on today and tomorrow it will be put back on the trailer. The trailer will come out of the shop tomorrow morning.

Midway through our work with the install we were both a thorough mess and the thought of grabbing a camera to take pictures was out of the question. We will take photos of the rusty jagged holes when we come back for the repair. We took photos pre-lift and tomorrow will take photos after-lift, and will post them here.

I hope this is helpful in someway.

Jim k
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Old 11-25-2018, 02:37 AM   #2857
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Jim,
Glad the lift went reasonably well. Man I HATE it when a project causes a little digging and the discovery of a new problem. At least you caught it in time to repair.
I can imagine the guys on the production line discovering the axle bolts holes did not line up with the frame hole, so they call the straw boss over and he says “ Easy, get the torch and cut’um”. Then they burn the paint off the frame and bolt it up and repeat until someone can get the frame company to relocate the holes.
The fact the they have a plasma torch it the assembly area is scary enough.
Imagine this Scenario in the automotive industry, “Hey Boss?”, “Yeah!”, “This axle hole ain’t lining up...” “Cut it!” “Ok”
Airstream has got to get “Repetitive Process Manufacturing” down. Same thing, Same way, Every time.
Justin, and the rest of the Airstream team, if you are listening. Don’t get me wrong, you guys do a lot of things “Very Right”. That why “I” own mine, but the little details are what’s Killing you.
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Old 11-25-2018, 04:03 AM   #2858
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Jim,
Glad the lift went reasonably well. Man I HATE it when a project causes a little digging and the discovery of a new problem. At least you caught it in time to repair.
I can imagine the guys on the production line discovering the axle bolts holes did not line up with the frame hole, so they call the straw boss over and he says “ Easy, get the torch and cut’um”. Then they burn the paint off the frame and bolt it up and repeat until someone can get the frame company to relocate the holes.
The fact the they have a plasma torch it the assembly area is scary enough.
Imagine this Scenario in the automotive industry, “Hey Boss?”, “Yeah!”, “This axle hole ain’t lining up...” “Cut it!” “Ok”
Airstream has got to get “Repetitive Process Manufacturing” down. Same thing, Same way, Every time.
Justin, and the rest of the Airstream team, if you are listening. Don’t get me wrong, you guys do a lot of things “Very Right”. That why “I” own mine, but the little details are what’s Killing you.
This is terrible. Ronnie, did you have any flame-cut holes in yours? If I understand correctly, yours is a 2014 and Jim's is a 2013... I wonder if the frame holes on all 2013s share this issue, or if it's unique to Jim's. Either way... bad.
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Old 11-25-2018, 08:07 AM   #2859
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Rob,
Mine where drilled and or punched into the frame. All where clean and lined up prefectly with the axle holes. Still very sad to hear that a torch and no paint was the factory’s option to fix Jim’s.
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Old 11-25-2018, 09:10 AM   #2860
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Rob,
Mine where drilled and or punched into the frame. All where clean and lined up prefectly with the axle holes. Still very sad to hear that a torch and no paint was the factory’s option to fix Jim’s.
Well, at least Jim is perfectly equipped to fix it!
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