Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 06-30-2008, 07:45 PM   #449
Aluminut
 
Silvertwinkie's Avatar
 
2004 25' Safari
. , Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,332
PSS- Not that this is related to the QC or corrosion issues in any way, nor is it the sole burden of Airstream Inc, but more of the economy in general.

Here is where Thor, the parent company of Airstream, Inc is situated today:

THO: Summary for THOR INDS INC - Yahoo! Finance

They may be debt free, but their stock value is currently less than half of what it was about 8 months ago (and this is the RVing season), yet Thor is in far better shape than most any of the other big RV builders. I also recall reading on this forum that Thor's warranty expenses were just way crazy.

At any rate, QC issues and corrosion on the flagship product isn't going to go well either in the long run. Folks here are right, these issues are going to come back and bite 'em in the behind if they are not properly addressed.

Airstream could have the perfect utopia if they didn't count the beans so tightly. Loyal customers willing to pay the prices due to the high quality of the builds and the high end service and warranty after the sale. Go figure, a very premium hand built product that is not rushed, but carefully and slowly built, tested and sent out the door well built with as near to zero defects as possible (compared to the very poor builds of today with many defects). Folks would be singing the praises of Airstream ownership it would make SOB owners sick. At one point Airstream had a lifetime warranty to the orig owner. Could you imagine a lifetime warranty today, with today's quality going out the door? They ain't no fools in Jackson Center. You get longer warranties out of computers than you do a purchase of tens of thousands of dollars.
__________________

__________________
Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq and millions of others are by far the most popular with about 70 million machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans note that cockroaches are far more numerous than humans and that numbers alone do not denote a higher life form. -NY Times 11/91
Silvertwinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2008, 07:47 PM   #450
Rivet Master
 
SilverGate's Avatar

 
2007 23' Safari SE
San Diego , California
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,460
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie View Post
PS- I also found it interesting that Airstream Life also has some of this info in their blog section, which I'm sure also generated some additional foot traffic toward this topic.
Thanks, Silvertwinkie.

Silvertwinkie is referring to my article, “Filiform corrosion”, which appeared in my History Safari Express column, which is one of currently seven columns on the Airsrteam Life Online Community web site.

Each of us writes about what interests us. Our content is our responsibility, and is not necessarily the opinion of Airstream Life Magazine.

I wrote about one of my current concerns and how I am dealing with it.

BTW, about 4 weeks ago I applied Boeshield T-9, (”Rust & Corrosion Protection, Waterproof Lubrication”, as stated on the label), and preliminary results show that the corrosion turned from whitish to grayish and has not grown larger. I will continue to monitor this and post new pictures of the treated corrosion areas later this summer when results will hopefully be more conclusive.
__________________

__________________
SilverGate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2008, 12:48 AM   #451
2 Rivet Member
 
ajdesq's Avatar
 
2008 532 International
Rye, East Sussex , UK
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 23
I'd love to think there is some truth to Silvertwinkie's post about this issue affecting sales due to the power of knowledge by would-be consumers.

From a UK perspective:

We only have one official dealer/importer in the whole country, and they're a great bunch of people. When I visited them, I saw a map of the UK on the wall with a pin showing the location for each 'new' EU AS owner in the country. I didn't count the pins, but reckon it was a healthy 30 or so.

When I pressed the UK rep about the corrosion issue, I was given various reassurances ('That's why we have a 1964 model on display outside' etc etc) but was interestingly also told that I was the FIRST european customer to challenge them about this, and about the warranty.

This might be to do with the fact that I think I'm the first 'average Joe' in the UK to buy one who earns an everyday wage, so this to me is a major-major-major purchase. It seems that up til now it's the City Boys with their five-figure bonuses and other people who have never RV'd in their life that are buying them here, so they are STILL selling well but purely based on marketing and image.

As I stated before, normal 'White Box' RVs in the UK have a 5 or 6 year warranty on the body. ALL RVs also have galvanised chassis. Our ASs have galvanised chassis, so why can't yours? And if we can have the galvanised chassis that Europe demands, can't we all have the 5 year body warranty? It doesn't sound unreasonable to me. I have one on my truck.

On the other hand, there are a LOT of negative people within the UK's RV industry and press simply waiting for European AS to fail, so they can sneer and say 'We told you it would never work'.

More than ever do AS need to make sure they get it right over here.

When Triumph motorcycles restarted in 1992, they knew that if just one of their engines blew up in the first couple of years of production, the company would fail. So they did it right. Now look at how successful they are. It ain't rocket engineering, is it?
__________________
Andrew

.
They all laugh because we're different.

We all laugh because they are all the same.
ajdesq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2008, 08:23 AM   #452
Rivet Master
 
Gene's Avatar
 
2008 25' Safari FB SE
Grand Junction , Colorado
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,828
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silvertwinkie View Post
Here is where Thor, the parent company of Airstream, Inc is situated today:

They may be debt free, but their stock value is currently less than half of what it was about 8 months ago (and this is the RVing season), yet Thor is in far better shape than most any of the other big RV builders.
I spent a little bit of time looking at Thor—two Wall St. analysts rate the stock "buy" and six rate it "hold". The consensus is "weak hold" since it's common to discount the analyst's ratings because of their history of pumping up stocks. A cursory look at the Thor's financials indicates to me that despite the slump in sales, the company is in good shape. If you want to bet that people will start buying a lot of RV's again at some point, this stock seems like a possible value buy because the stock prices is down far more than the market. In the present stock doldrums, whole sectors have cratered dragging down the stock prices of the best companies in a sector as well as the bad ones.

Getting back to corrosion, this means the company's financial position is pretty good and they feel no pressure to honor warranties. That seems to be unwise—they are looking at the short term as many companies do.

So far as asdesq's post, we have weak regulations on safety and quality in the US and we pay the price for it as individuals. On another thread it was shown the Canadian axle supports more weight. It can be ordered here, but the dealers don't even know about it. I think a lot of people would buy the European version for quality and other reasons if they could.

Gene
__________________
Gene is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2008, 10:32 AM   #453
4 Rivet Member
 
SafariSS's Avatar
 
2005 30' Safari
Houston Texas , Texas
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 475
+1 on european quality..

I would gladly pay 1500 bucks or whatever they wanted for a fully galvanized frame and composite floor deck. Quality and extended life is what I think they should be marketing.

I think with the new Safari Sport lineup they would rather move volume than high dollar lower volume rigs.

Fairly happy with my 05 that I have had almost 2 years, aside from some corrosion. I am planning on doing a two year report with my unit.
__________________
SafariSS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2008, 02:12 PM   #454
4 Rivet Member
 
deauxrite's Avatar
 
2007 27' Safari FB SE
Full Timers just passing through , Arizona for a couple of weeks and then on to Utah!
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 325
Add me to the list. Both tail light housings, door grab handle and a few rivits in various places. Man am I ticked!
__________________
Living life on the Road
deauxrite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2008, 08:34 AM   #455
Rivet Master
 
RIstream'n's Avatar
 
2008 27' Safari FB SE
Cumberland , RI
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 506
I am at the AS factory right now addressing a couple of issues. One of them is corrosion. I have it starting on all 4 of the wheels, the entry door grab handle and along the belt line on the end caps it is starting. They told me it wasn't covered. I requested to talk wit the warranty administrator and after some idle conversation about well it looks like I take care of the AS he took me out to the trailer and said if I used Corrosion X, "which we sell in our store" it will stop it. Huh?? Why did it happen? "Something in the enviorment". He says Corrosion X will turn it gray and stop it. ???????????????????????????????????????
__________________
Brian & Donna
08 27' Safari FB SE
03 Avalanche 2500
WBCCI #1199 - AIR #23847
NEU
LIFE IS GOOD
RIstream'n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2008, 08:53 AM   #456
Rivet Master
 
2003 25' Safari
Eden Prairie , Minnesota
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 762
Images: 3
Several years ago Airstream did replace my wheels, and some skins and other parts under warranty due to similar corrosion.

However...

- the replaced skins do not look good-as-new
- the corrosion on the wheels and other parts came right back

So their work accomplished nothing.

Ask them how Corrosion-X can get under the clearcoat to reach the filliform corrosion cells.

Frankly, at this time I believe there is no solution.
__________________
Dan
dmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2008, 10:30 AM   #457
_
 
. , .
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 8,812
hi ri'

Quote:
Originally Posted by RIstream'n View Post
... I requested to talk wit the warranty administrator and after some idle conversation...
and that is ALL u will get with him, idle conversation.

think of his role, as like the health insurance person who says "sorry denied" that treatment is experimental.

and back b4 we were connecting with each other on this issue, they DID occasionally replace wheels or trim or skin...

IF you really wanna get some attention ask to speak with bob wheeler, the president of a/s, at least for now...

or write a letter (on paper) to the corp wigs.

the service shop and especially the warranty czar, is stonewalling YOU and everyone else now, on this issue.

and ask them HOW they've proven any topical spary WORKS, since they deny the problem exists...

the simple truth is they've read about the anti corrosion sprays and what they do HERE...

cheers
2air'
__________________
all of the true things that i am about to tell you are shameless lies. l.b.j.

we are here on earth to fart around. don't let anybody tell you any different. k.v.
2airishuman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2008, 07:08 PM   #458
Rivet Master
 
TIMEMACHINE's Avatar
 
2006 25' Safari FB SE
Huntington Beach , California
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,293
Images: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2airishuman View Post
and ask them HOW they've proven any topical spary WORKS, since they deny the problem exists...

cheers
2air'
That would be a great question!

double cheers
time
__________________
Travel is in my blood, adventure is my passport, aluminum is my favorite construction medium, and therefore, an Airstream was my destiny.
TIMEMACHINE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2008, 08:23 PM   #459
Rivet Master
 
RIstream'n's Avatar
 
2008 27' Safari FB SE
Cumberland , RI
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 506
Frankly I didn't push him too much because I figured even if they did replace the wheels it would come back and even if I got them to do the belt line trim molding that would just be covering the problem. Truth is there is no solution so I didn't know where to push him... He did notice and make a comment about my AIR forums sticker on the window so I'm sure he knew he couldn't deny there was something going on.
__________________
Brian & Donna
08 27' Safari FB SE
03 Avalanche 2500
WBCCI #1199 - AIR #23847
NEU
LIFE IS GOOD
RIstream'n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2008, 08:41 PM   #460
Aluminut
 
Silvertwinkie's Avatar
 
2004 25' Safari
. , Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,332
It's just tragic how badly they've handled this issue. All I can say is for anyone reading this, let your wallet (or purse) do your talking, because the factory just isn't listening.

Those of you who already have an Airstream, I can only imagine what you might do when it's time to replace or upgrade. I know what my plans are, and it won't be another new Airstream. Maybe a pre-owned, but I won't buy a single new Airstream until this issue is fully addressed at the production level. Imagine if most of us did this.....

Great fix by the way. Go put that product on your Airstream and instead of white lines, you have gray like lines. Almost as good as tech support telling me to put clear nail polish on the places mine were showing up. When I told the rep that it's everywhere and questioned if he really expected me to put clear nail polish all over my Safari, it was like a dial tone........

I have received yet another few folks to be added to the off line list.

I have no idea what the next steps are but I would suggest the following:

PM me your name, address (phone optional), email address, vin and a description of your corrosion problems. Posting pictures here also would be a great help.

Second, if you are on the road, going to a dealer, grab the VIN and take some pics, post the year, model, and post the pics here for all to see.
__________________
Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq and millions of others are by far the most popular with about 70 million machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans note that cockroaches are far more numerous than humans and that numbers alone do not denote a higher life form. -NY Times 11/91
Silvertwinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-15-2008, 08:43 PM   #461
Aluminut
 
Silvertwinkie's Avatar
 
2004 25' Safari
. , Illinois
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,332
BTW Brian, you spent most likely well over $40k on your Safari. If this was the answer the auto dealer were to give you about your paint peeling off or something similar, would you not press it? If you are at the factory, I would press it full court. You spent good hard earned money on your vehicle. I agree, I'd ask to speak to Wheeler. Dave Schumann totally blew me off too. Difference is, I'm here in Illinois, you are at Jackson Center. There are more options when you are face to face........
__________________
Computers manufactured by companies such as IBM, Compaq and millions of others are by far the most popular with about 70 million machines in use worldwide. Macintosh fans note that cockroaches are far more numerous than humans and that numbers alone do not denote a higher life form. -NY Times 11/91
Silvertwinkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2008, 08:15 AM   #462
Rivet Master
 
2003 25' Safari
Eden Prairie , Minnesota
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 762
Images: 3
You made a wise choice... there is nothing that they can do to fix your unit. If the Corrosion-X spray can work its way under the clear and slow down the progress of corrosion, then that is worth a try. Replacing the wheels would make you feel good for about 6 months, upon which the worm tracks start again. Replacing skins... forgetaboutit, the solution is worse than the problem.

My trailer is now 6 years old. It had corrosion problems from the beginning. However, surprisingly, it has not gotten significantly worse over time. But I store it inside, and now in an insulated/heated airplane hangar. I wash it once or twice a year, and have Walbernized it a couple times.

So far the corrosion is aesthetic, and not structural. The worst of it originates from under the taillights. I don't think it would help if I just spray the visible corrosion areas with Corrosion-X, because the corrosion is under the clearcoat. I'd need to remove the taillights and spray the cut edges of the aluminum, where I believe the corrosion began. Then hope that some of the spray works its way through the worm tracks, which seems unlikely, to help slow future corrosion.

Somewhat related, the belly skin under the rear of my trailer was attached around the edges by pop-rivits. It supports the insulation between it and the wood floor. A while ago, the belly pan came loose, and the insulation fell out. Some of the rivits broke, others pulled through the belly pan. This was partly due to dissimilar metals corrosion, and partly due to the need for better support of the belly pan. I installed replacement insulation and reattached the pan using rivits with oversized washers, and added an extruded aluminum L-rail to support the field.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RIstream'n View Post
Frankly I didn't push him too much because I figured even if they did replace the wheels it would come back and even if I got them to do the belt line trim molding that would just be covering the problem. Truth is there is no solution so I didn't know where to push him... He did notice and make a comment about my AIR forums sticker on the window so I'm sure he knew he couldn't deny there was something going on.
__________________

__________________
Dan
dmac is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Stainless steel corrosion Dave-O Stoves, Ovens & Microwaves 21 04-05-2014 06:30 PM
How did you get into Airstreams & Airstreaming? 83Excella Our Community 102 03-15-2009 09:48 AM
Airstreams in winter?? Curtis-79MH Airstream Motorhome Forums 6 03-27-2006 12:58 PM
Black water problems Rob Waste Systems, Tanks & Totes 3 08-31-2002 07:34 PM
Ralph Lauren Vintage Airstreams ($150,000) Andy R General Interior Topics 0 02-22-2002 12:06 AM


Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by



Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

Airstream is a registered trademark of Airstream Inc. All rights reserved. Airstream trademark used under license to Social Knowledge LLC.