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Phoenix · 08-20-2016, 12:56 PM

Just a comment: The new CAPTCHA "I'm not a robot" that pops up when previewing messages make editing very frustrating.

Some of the photos are so dark or unclear, or subject to interpretation, that I found that about 50% of the time, I got locked out. For example, the photo of some parfait/mousse dessert looked like a drink to me, so I got dumped. Luckily, I was saving my edits off-line; so I didn't lose my lengthy message.

It looks like CAPTCHA also has script and obsured text that can be re-entered, instead of using photos. If you think this level of bot protection is really necessary, could you please consider using some other "challenge" method that is less likely to lock out valid users?

Also, perhaps the challenge could be limited to the "submit" button, and not "preview".

Thanks!

Rich W · 08-20-2016, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix

Just a comment: The new CAPTCHA "I'm not a robot" that pops up when previewing messages make editing very frustrating.

Some of the photos are so dark or unclear, or subject to interpretation, that I found that about 50% of the time, I got locked out. For example, the photo of some parfait/mousse dessert looked like a drink to me, so I got dumped. Luckily, I was saving my edits off-line; so I didn't lose my lengthy message.

It looks like CAPTCHA also has script and obsured text that can be re-entered, instead of using photos. If you think this level of bot protection is really necessary, could you please consider using some other "challenge" method that is less likely to lock out valid users?

Also, perhaps the challenge could be limited to the "submit" button, and not "preview".

Thanks!

Is that something new? I haven't seen any of the CAPTCHA screens. I'm using Windows 7 and IE 11. What browser are you seeing this in?

AWCHIEF · 08-20-2016, 04:06 PM

Have not experienced that, yet.

OTRA15 · 08-20-2016, 04:17 PM

I had problems early this morning. See Posts #3&4 here:

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f138...ur-155553.html

Quote:

Originally Posted by OTRA15

This is happening again IMO, and the Captcha process does not seem to be working right. If the site is "Down for Maintenance" could there please be a screen to that effect? I have tried multiple sessions ending up at the Captcha dead end every time.
. . .
PS -- The Captcha images are very small and hard to decipher, as to whether each one contains, for instance, a store front, grass etc.. Any chance to using the standard other process in which the user simply has to type in a string of text symbols which appear in a site-generated "I'm not a robot" box?
. . .

I have not had any problems for the rest of today. [Firefox on a Mac laptop]

HiJoeSilver · 08-20-2016, 06:32 PM

I have never had to use a CAPTCHA on the Airforums.

SilverGate · 08-20-2016, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix

Just a comment: The new CAPTCHA "I'm not a robot" that pops up when previewing messages make editing very frustrating.

Some of the photos are so dark or unclear, or subject to interpretation, that I found that about 50% of the time, I got locked out. For example, the photo of some parfait/mousse dessert looked like a drink to me, so I got dumped. Luckily, I was saving my edits off-line; so I didn't lose my lengthy message.

It looks like CAPTCHA also has script and obsured text that can be re-entered, instead of using photos. If you think this level of bot protection is really necessary, could you please consider using some other "challenge" method that is less likely to lock out valid users?

Also, perhaps the challenge could be limited to the "submit" button, and not "preview".

Thanks!

Thanks, Phoenix, for raising this concern and I agree that some of the images presented in the CAPTCHA test to determine if you are a robot are not clear or obvious, especially when I use a laptop computer.

For others here who have not seen what we are talking about, I emphasized in bold your words above. The CAPTCHA test appears on occasion when you have completed a rather lengthy post or have taken a rather long time to compose a post, and when you click on "Submit Reply" or "Preview", the CAPTCHA test appears, and you must correctly respond to the test for your post to be published (appear on AirForums).

I agree that there should be an easier test (some CAPTCHA tests use scripted letters, which I think is easier to see, sometimes).

-- Bill (not a robot!)

SilverGate · 08-20-2016, 07:10 PM

CAPTCHA

Phoenix · 08-20-2016, 10:00 PM

Bill (SilverGate), thanks for the explanation. Yes, I was editing a PM (Private Message) that exceeded 10,000 characters; and I had to condense my message below this limit. Due to the amount of text, I was "previewing" the message frequently; and I kept getting CAPTCHA challenges.

I understand the reason for using this program, but it was very frustrating being blocked about 50% of the time due to guessing incorrectly. As I mentioned previously, some photos were either so dark that I couldn't determine exactly what it was; or the item was subject to interpretation, and I guessed wrong.

Anyway, now that I know that message length is what triggers CAPTCHA, I'll try not to be so verbose.

Thanks!

Ag&Au · 08-21-2016, 12:26 AM

What kind of serious problem are we trying to solve with this ?

Is someone trying to steal national security files?

Ken

SilverGate · 08-21-2016, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix

Bill (SilverGate), thanks for the explanation. Yes, I was editing a PM (Private Message) that exceeded 10,000 characters; and I had to condense my message below this limit. Due to the amount of text, I was "previewing" the message frequently; and I kept getting CAPTCHA challenges.

I understand the reason for using this program, but it was very frustrating being blocked about 50% of the time due to guessing incorrectly. As I mentioned previously, some photos were either so dark that I couldn't determine exactly what it was; or the item was subject to interpretation, and I guessed wrong.

Anyway, now that I know that message length is what triggers CAPTCHA, I'll try not to be so verbose.

Thanks!

You're welcome. Message length may be a trigger, but the several times that I've encountered CAPTCHA here is when I was composing a post while researching supporting material, links, YouTube videos, etc., which took over 20-30 minutes to complete. And when I clicked on the "Submit reply", the CAPTCHA test appeared.

I suspect that CAPTCHA is intermittently triggered by a variety of actions that the website's Application Firewall rules have deemed to be "suspicious activity" (i.e. an internet bot).

One way to avoid frustrations of losing a long message or post is to copy the message or post on a Word Document just before submitting it to the forums. Then if the CAPTCHA test appears and is problematic, you can try again or wait until later to post without fear of losing your content.

Bill

ROBERTSUNRUS · 08-21-2016, 01:34 AM

Hi, I was trying to respond to a private message and got this. So I just canceled the message.

OTRA15 · 08-21-2016, 05:36 AM

I am guessing from the recent posts here, and from the other thread, that the Captcha process is indeed related to the length of a post, and/or to the span of time for which the "Reply to Thread" window has been open. Longer posts, and extended time drafting a post, may trigger some coding which then activates the Captcha. Just a guess, but the site team and moderators might want to check with the IT people on this. Folks who reply using mainly a phone, or small tablet, may never trigger this threshold as their posts [and time drafting] are generally shorter IMO.

The recent heat and humidity in the Northeast is supposed to ease next week, so maybe I won't feel so Captcha'd if this happens again!

Cheers,

Peter

PS -- And thanks for a great site.
PS2 -- This thread is a better place to discuss the Captcha issues, compared to the other thread IMO, because of its title incl. "Captcha":

http://www.airforums.com/forums/f138...ur-155553.html

Ag&Au · 08-21-2016, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ag&Au

What kind of serious problem are we trying to solve with this ?

Is someone trying to steal national security files?

Ken

I will admit my question was sarcastically worded, however does anyone know the answer? What is happening that requires this nonsense to be needed?

Or is this nonsense really not happening and I'm being pranked?

Ken

xrvr · 08-21-2016, 11:09 AM

I'd like to know also.

OTRA15 · 08-21-2016, 11:18 AM

The site has undergone a number of Directed Denial of Service [DDOS] attacks in the last year or so (from my observation as a user -- I have no connection to the site administration), and when those DDOS "bad robots" find an opening into this site's servers, they can bombard the site with so much, that the site becomes inoperable for normal functions. AirForums is not alone in dealing with this Internet nonsense by any means, but it requires constant attention and perseverance. It is also expensive from an IT perspective.

I trust -- entirely -- that the site admins and mods are doing their best to let our experience be as seamless as possible.

A DDOS attack may seem like a trivial issue (not a "stealing national security files" threat), but it is still a total pain in the butt to deal with.

A hearty thank you, once again, is due to AirForums IMO.

Cheers,

Peter

SilverGate · 08-21-2016, 11:38 AM

The History of CAPTCHA

linda833 · 08-21-2016, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ag&Au

I will admit my question was sarcastically worded, however does anyone know the answer? What is happening that requires this nonsense to be needed?

Or is this nonsense really not happening and I'm being pranked?

Ken

In responding to Ken -- i'm perplexed why Captcha is used so often when it does not pertain to national security. I run into this on many benign sites and am also kicked off bc of the unreadability of the Captcha. Lately i've also encountered "how many images contain flowers, etc" and some images are too small to determine whats in them. Surely if websites want to block spam, there can be another way. I have since refused to return to websites that use these as i'm always getting kicked off anyway.

Rjpuckett · 08-21-2016, 12:00 PM

Porn sites and other advertisers use robots to post in unprotected sites.

rmkrum · 08-21-2016, 12:47 PM

The problem is that the robots can build new accounts faster than humans can find and kill the bogus accounts.

Captcha is not wonderful, but it does slow the buggers down a lot.

Keep in mind that volunteers, no matter how many, cannot be expected to spend all their waking hours trying to kill thousands of bogus accounts that could be loaded per HOUR. It's just not possible.

Sent from my pocket Internet using Airstream Forums

OTRA15 · 08-21-2016, 02:10 PM

I just got Captcha'd again drafting a long reply with some copy and paste from a PDF, and did not guess correctly about lawns, store fronts etc.. Hit the Captcha dead end blank screen.

So, I hit the Back button on my browser until I saw the draft text in the Reply box, then Edit (or right mouse click) and Select All, then Copy.

Then logged out of AirFor, which cleared cookies which IMO can lead to Captcha, then logged back in, replied to the thread, and hit Paste in the reply text box. Convoluted, but I had forgotten to draft the reply in Word first.

There has to be an easier way.

Could the site remember us by our IP address, if we gave permission for this, to avoid Captcha because we have a "safe" IP address? [After all, isn't this part of the Captcha process -- remembering our IP address for each login?]